(UPDATE: I have a post up at C&L regarding the Gore speech today)
Al Gore gave an astoundingly good speech today, attacking the Bush Administration's lawless eavesdropping in a very reasoned but still clear and principled way. I never liked Al Gore when he was a politician - he was calculating, self-serving and programmable. But he was always interested in ideas and has clearly been emancipated as a result of his loss from the forces which suffocated him forever.
If Bush opponents made the case against the Administration the way Gore did today - with appeals to the universal American values and traditions which are so plainly under assault by George Bush -- then overly cautious Bush opponents could stop fretting about the scary political implications of standing up to Bush's law-breaking. Americans understand the arguments Gore made on an instinctive level.
The whole speech by Gore (who, it's worth remembering, received more votes than Bush when they ran against each other) should really be read. Here are a few highlights:
The result was the Foreign Intelligence and Surveillance Act (FISA), which was enacted expressly to ensure that foreign intelligence surveillance would be presented to an impartial judge to verify that there is a sufficient cause for the surveillance. I voted for that law during my first term in Congress and for almost thirty years the system has proven a workable and valued means of according a level of protection for private citizens, while permitting foreign surveillance to continue.
Yet, just one month ago, Americans awoke to the shocking news that in spite of this long settled law, the Executive Branch has been secretly spying on large numbers of Americans for the last four years and eavesdropping on "large volumes of telephone calls, e-mail messages, and other Internet traffic inside the United States." The New York Times reported that the President decided to launch this massive eavesdropping program "without search warrants or any new laws that would permit such domestic intelligence collection."
During the period when this eavesdropping was still secret, the President went out of his way to reassure the American people on more than one occasion that, of course, judicial permission is required for any government spying on American citizens and that, of course, these constitutional safeguards were still in place.
But surprisingly, the President's soothing statements turned out to be false. Moreover, as soon as this massive domestic spying program was uncovered by the press, the President not only confirmed that the story was true, but also declared that he has no intention of bringing these wholesale invasions of privacy to an end.
At present, we still have much to learn about the NSA's domestic surveillance. What we do know about this pervasive wiretapping virtually compels the conclusion that the President of the United States has been breaking the law repeatedly and persistently
A president who breaks the law is a threat to the very structure of our government. Our Founding Fathers were adamant that they had established a government of laws and not men. Indeed, they recognized that the structure of government they had enshrined in our Constitution - our system of checks and balances - was designed with a central purpose of ensuring that it would govern through the rule of law. As John Adams said: "The executive shall never exercise the legislative and judicial powers, or either of them, to the end that it may be a government of laws and not of men."
An executive who arrogates to himself the power to ignore the legitimate legislative directives of the Congress or to act free of the check of the judiciary becomes the central threat that the Founders sought to nullify in the Constitution - an all-powerful executive too reminiscent of the King from whom they had broken free. In the words of James Madison, "the accumulation of all powers, legislative, executive, and judiciary, in the same hands, whether of one, a few, or many, and whether hereditary, self-appointed, or elective, may justly be pronounced the very definition of tyranny."
Thomas Paine, whose pamphlet, "On Common Sense" ignited the American Revolution, succinctly described America's alternative. Here, he said, we intended to make certain that "the law is king."
Vigilant adherence to the rule of law strengthens our democracy and strengthens America. It ensures that those who govern us operate within our constitutional structure, which means that our democratic institutions play their indispensable role in shaping policy and determining the direction of our nation. It means that the people of this nation ultimately determine its course and not executive officials operating in secret without constraint.
The rule of law makes us stronger by ensuring that decisions will be tested, studied, reviewed and examined through the processes of government that are designed to improve policy. And the knowledge that they will be reviewed prevents over-reaching and checks the accretion of power. . . . .
Can it be true that any president really has such powers under our Constitution? If the answer is "yes" then under the theory by which these acts are committed, are there any acts that can on their face be prohibited? If the President has the inherent authority to eavesdrop, imprison citizens on his own declaration, kidnap and torture, then what can't he do?
The Dean of Yale Law School, Harold Koh, said after analyzing the Executive Branch's claims of these previously unrecognized powers: "If the President has commander-in-chief power to commit torture, he has the power to commit genocide, to sanction slavery, to promote apartheid, to license summary execution."
The fact that our normal safeguards have thus far failed to contain this unprecedented expansion of executive power is deeply troubling. This failure is due in part to the fact that the Executive Branch has followed a determined strategy of obfuscating, delaying, withholding information, appearing to yield but then refusing to do so and dissembling in order to frustrate the efforts of the legislative and judicial branches to restore our constitutional balance.
Moreover, if the pattern of practice begun by this Administration is not challenged, it may well become a permanent part of the American system. Many conservatives have pointed out that granting unchecked power to this President means that the next President will have unchecked power as well. And the next President may be someone whose values and belief you do not trust. And this is why Republicans as well as Democrats should be concerned with what this President has done. If this President's attempt to dramatically expand executive power goes unquestioned, our constitutional design of checks and balances will be lost. And the next President or some future President will be able, in the name of national security, to restrict our liberties in a way the framers never would have thought possible. . . .
We have a duty as Americans to defend our citizens' right not only to life but also to liberty and the pursuit of happiness. It is therefore vital in our current circumstances that immediate steps be taken to safeguard our Constitution against the present danger posed by the intrusive overreaching on the part of the Executive Branch and the President's apparent belief that he need not live under the rule of law.
I endorse the words of Bob Barr, when he said, "The President has dared the American people to do something about it. For the sake of the Constitution, I hope they will."
Sounds like he's been reading your blog.
ReplyDeleteWe are eerily following the path of the Roman Republic. Soon the Senate will offer Bush a crown.
ReplyDeleteWatch out ... Gore is back
ReplyDeletemynewsbot.com
His speech was quite good, but it could have been even better and tougher- he was mindful of some Clinton vulberabilities on this issue, I think.
ReplyDeleteI watched it on C-Span, and was enthralled, but I had the same thought about his avoiding Clinton vulnerabilities. To understate, I am no Gore fan overall, but that speech rocked.
It also seeemd to me his speechwriter must be reading this blog.
Glenn,
ReplyDeleteWhy is it worthy of noting that Gore got more votes than Bush in the popular vote? The constitution provides for a winner based upon who gets the most electoral votes.
Popular vote was not the aim of the race. If it was Bush would have spent his time differently running up popular votes in Texas and other strongholds and possibly even in California.
Bush won. All counts showed he won. 7 out of 8 newspaper and other recounts showed he won. He won. Get over it. Move on.
Did Gore do a preachers speech today with the screams from the pulpit and spots for amens from the faithful flock of Bush haters?
Gore is an inane idiot. Even Clinton thought so. I think that the NSA story was predicted by global warming theory. It predicts everything else known to the universe, hot, cold, wet, dry, mini-ice age in Europe, etc. etc.
Says the Dog
And since you seem to be ignoring MLK day in favor of BDS, here is some excerpts from my blog post today on MLK day:
the "Dog" on MLK day
This is the meaning of Martin Luther King day, it recognizes the culmination of 175 years of struggle, debate, war, and death in the final fulfillment of what was begun by the founders with Article 1, Sect. 9, continued by enactments of congress in the early 1800's, enhanced at the risk of the destruction of the country as a whole by Lincoln's emancipation proclamation, solidified in our founding documents by the 13th, 14th, and 15th amendments, and finally written in our hearts by the example, struggle, life, and death of Dr. Martin Luther King and those like him.
When viewed in this context, I find that Martin Luther King day is a holiday for all Americans of every color, to jointly celebrate and rejoice in the victory (too long coming) of good over evil. I wish that the actual celebrations we will see on our televisions and in our newspapers and magazines would take this high road, and call for a renewal of these ideals that Dr. King caused to be written in our collective hearts. Unfortunately, Martin Luther King day has been corrupted by politicians and those who seek fame and fortune by flagging the flames of racial divide, the promotion of disunity, and the denial of the positive, substantial, and indispensable contributions of white males and the Republican party, which culminated in Dr. King's affect on the collective heart of our nation. Instead of recognizing that for which this day of celebration and reflection was intended. These race baitors of the left and Democratic party will defile the purpose of today's holiday by turning it into a hate Bush and, in more subtle form, hate whitey day.
I reject the race baitors, and I hope all other thoughtful people of all colors will as well.
Says the "Dog"
Why is it worthy of noting that Gore got more votes than Bush in the popular vote?
ReplyDeleteI just know that all of your friends in the Bush-loving blogosphere and elsewhere are going to feel threatened by Gore's speech and so will betrotting out their old reliable depictions of Al Gore as the left-wing rabid fringe lunatic who stands in contrast to George Bush, the Man of the American Heartland and the People (with the 39% approval ratings).
It's always worth reminding people how dishonest that depiction is. I'm not one of those hung up on the 2000 election - I think it was a tie and someone had to win - but Gore received many more votes than Bush did, which ought to (but won't) prevent the suggestion that Bush is somehow beloved by The People and Gore is a fringe freak out of step with Americans.
Refreshing to hear an American leader who can speak with passion - and in complete sentences, too. Great speech!
ReplyDeleteIt's good to start seeing things in the blogosphere spill over into real life. I don't know if there's a connection or not, but Al Gore sounded like Digby, Atrios, Jane, Glenn, etc. on this issue. VERY refreshing!!!
ReplyDeleteThe fool returns to his folly as The Dog returns to its vomit.
ReplyDeleteProverbs 26:11.
Just sayin'
Excellent post Glenn, both here and at C&L. I have no doubt that the Freepi will drag out their usual bag of tricks to dismiss this speech.
ReplyDeleteI don't believe that the election was too close to call. The intent of the voters in Florida was clear. That election was shot through with fraud and deception, but most Americans have been led to believe differently by the same type of distortionary propaganda I've sort of turned into my bailiwick on this forum.
ReplyDeleteIf I can find time, I may try to say more than just, "I looked into this at great length and this is what I think," but it isn't easy to be persuasive on this subject, most people generally feel they've hoed this ground and aren't necessarily open to hearing more or moving an inch from their claimed positions, so I don't know that it would do much good.
One thing I'd like to point out, however, is that exit poll discrepancies are considered in countries (Ukraine, for example) as red flags for possible fraud. In this country, the exit polls in 2000 showed Gore ahead by over 50,000 votes in Florida. In 2004, the polls showed Kerry ahead by three percent nationwide and also ahead in key states; the NY Times in its late afternoon Nov. 2 edition said Kerry was ahead nationwide "beyond the margin of error." But these polls, which still said Kerry was ahead by three percent at 1 a.m., Nov 3, were mixed and mashed, shaken and baken, and suddenly appeared to agree with the "real results," in which Bush won.
What we should have then seen, both in Florida 2000 and nationwide in 2004, was an examination of two hypotheses: (1) The exit polls were right and an indication of massive fraud, or; (2) The exit polls were wrong. But what we witnessed instead was a cursory examination of the second option only, along with a sort of smear attack on exit polls generally, using similar mechanisms to what we've seen elsewhere: campaigns against not only people (Gore himself, Paul O'Neill, Richard Clarke, Scott Ritter and others); but also things, and groups (Kerry's war record, Wellstone's memorial service, the entire country of France. Oh, and the voters in Palm Beach, who were garnering nationwide sympathy until the anti-semitic jokes and cartoons on the theme of their skill at Bingo and their stupidity as voters, started magically circulating.)
Meanwhile, academic studies showing that Kerry almost certainly won (google on exit poll discrepancy 2004) were utterly ignored by the mainstream media, and Kerry himself (as per usual with Democrats) took the bullet for the sake of the country, or whatever he thought he was doing. One of his advisors, associate dean of Yale Law School, later expressed regrets for the role he played in counselling Kerry to concede.
None of that proves the election was stolen, but an attempted proof, as I mentioned, would take more time than I can give it now. And no, this is not about sour grapes. Had my candidate behaved this way, he would no longer be my candidate. And in my view, as mentioned earlier, the real winner that year had the election been fair would probably have been John McCain, who was the victim of yet another smear campaign, in the absence of which he would undoubtedly have gone on to win the primary and very likely the election.
In any case, I doubt you'll see too many exit poll results being given out before the final vote count in future elections. It'll be easy to sell Americans on that, because we've all been taught to distrust the exit polls, even though they work perfectly well in other countries and always were quite accurate in this country too, before they started being used during elections involving George W. Bush. So watch out for that!
Brambling,
ReplyDeleteI surprised you didn't quote any studies and exit polls showing that UFO's were flying over critical polling stations and beaming things directly into the minds of voters and poll workers to change votes.
The Alien UFO conspiracy is every bit as plausible, accurate, and well researched as all the other bullshit you were spewing forth in that last post.
It did make for some hilariously funny entertaining reading however. As I read it, I pictured you at home on the computer, with Tin Foil Hat, pooring over your research. LOL
Bush won. Bush won all the recounts. Bush won all the heavily biased media recounts save one that was so biased that even the biased media didn't believe it.
Get over it.
Says the "Dog"
Glenn said:
ReplyDeleteI just know that all of your friends in the Bush-loving blogosphere and elsewhere are going to feel threatened by Gore's speech
Hardly. Al Gore has succeeded in making such a joke of himself since 2000 that only the deanwits pay any attention to his blather. Even a lot of the MSM has given up on him for lacking credibility.
Maybe Al could try and complete divinity school. Maybe he could use his complete sentences to try and actually pass this time.
Al Gore as the left-wing rabid fringe lunatic who stands in contrast to George Bush, the Man of the American Heartland and the People (with the 39% approval ratings).
Algore's bonafides as a member of the lunatic fringe were confirmed by Algore, and shown quite clearly by his erratic behavior since 2000. Algore was freed by 2000 to let America see the real Algore and lunatic fringe is what they saw. We on the right didn't have anything to do with it.
Bush's approval ratings are 45%. Have been for quite a while. Numerous polls show convincingly that they support the NSA operation as well.
but Gore received many more votes than Bush did,
Running up votes in New York and California doesn't impress. He should have been working harder to run up votes in his own home district in Tennessee. Had he taken that district he would have taken Tennessee and would have been elected president in 2000. Instead his incompetence and lunatic fringe nature kept those who know him best (his home district in Tennessee from supporting him).
Bush is somehow beloved by The People and Gore is a fringe freak out of step with Americans.
Now you're talking.
Says the "Dog"
Ya gotta love "the dog". He can't decide if he's the "dog" or "the dog".
ReplyDeleteWoof!
Yip, yip! Yap yap yap!!
ReplyDeleteWho's Al Gore?
ReplyDeleteMy favorite part is the predominantly black voters who were disenfranchised for crimes that they committed at some point in the future (325 such cases according to Harpers, in a race won by 537 votes). That was a good one.
ReplyDeleteHey the dog, since your points consist of insults, lies, and illogical rhetoric I suggest you consider changing your name to "the jackass".
ReplyDeleteYour view of MLK day as a day to celebrate white male Republican accomplishment is jackassinine. I refer to "and the denial of the positive, substantial, and indispensable contributions of white males and the Republican party". PUT THE GLASS PIPE DOWN!
I notice you had no comment on the topic of Mr. Gore's speech. Only an inane idiot would focus their criticism of the blog on the inclusion of the 2000 election results (don't even start to think Bush could have won in CA) when the topic is Mr. Gore's speech about the unconstitutionality of our President's actions.
Why would Bob Barr, the chief prosecutor in the Clinton impeachment hearings, share Mr. Gore's opinions on this issue?
Next time, if you wish to be taken seriously, either post some links to facts to back up your ridiculous claims or be regarded as a fool.
Glen, Gore also made a point I haven't heard elsewhere, that the telcos desist from permitting taps on their customers data, voice and billing records without court order.
ReplyDeleteThis is no small thing, the way these corporations have sold out the customers they've pledged to protect. It's worth noting that (according to the NYT) the telcos/isps allowed the installation of taps for bulk snooping, without any court orders.
Wonder if the eagerness to betray their customers has anything to do with all deregulation the telcos/isp s long for?
"a day to celebrate white male Republican accomplishment"
ReplyDeleteSo the left is arguing that Congress has the constitutional authority to impose a statutory requirement directing the president to submit military intelligence gathering decisions and related classified information to federal judges for approval. Ooop's, looks like FISA is unconstitutional.
Can't wait for Congress to tackle this one. Viva La Reagan revolution!
glenn: I never liked Al Gore when he was a politician - he was calculating, self-serving and programmable.
ReplyDeleteSame here. I think being out of office has done him good. There was some talk of Gore2008 though I think Mark Warner has captured much of this enthusiasm for now.
The speech had good moments -- especially when he accused George Bush of breaking the law and demanding a special prosecutor. That kind of line is what you expect from leaders, in a good sense. They define the issue and give voice to the feeling.
I think Bush's arrogance is slowing leading him to the precipice. As a sort of survival tactic, Congress is going to turn up the heat on him.
Back to the speech, I guess my favorite part was the following:
"The rule of law makes us stronger by ensuring that decisions will be tested, studied, reviewed and examined through the processes of government that are designed to improve policy. And the knowledge that they will be reviewed prevents over-reaching and checks the accretion of power.
A commitment to openness, truthfulness and accountability also helps our country avoid many serious mistakes."
We all know that Bush is probably the most incompentent president we've ever had. Part of the reason for this must be his knee-jerk unwillingness to abide by the rules which he probably feels are for lusers. Of course, what he's doing is discarding the safeguards of democratic practice. He's literally rushing in where democratic practice would fear to tread.
Gore has made a series of excellent speeches, starting in Sept. 2002.
ReplyDeleteAnd I believe he is his own speechwriter.
It's a pity that some commenters here can only respond to the ideas and arguments Gore makes with insults. Guess they've been listening to Bush too long...
I just love it when some anonymous poster unwilling to even adopt a pretend name makes a post of no links or facts and nothing but name calling, and then demands that someone else present facts and links lest Mr. Anonymous be offended.
ReplyDeleteLOL, I throw pearls before swine.
Says the "Dog"
Ummm, you're posting as "The Dog" and so what's the matter with someone else posting as "Anonymous"?
ReplyDeletebut I had the same thought about his avoiding Clinton vulnerabilities.
ReplyDeleteWell, if you consider how he ran from a still-popular President in 2000, and jumped out to endorse someone other than the Clinton candidate in 2004, I think he's been cool on Clinton for a while.
So the left is arguing that Congress has the constitutional authority to impose a statutory requirement directing the president to submit military intelligence gathering decisions and related classified information to federal judges for approval. Ooop's, looks like FISA is unconstitutional.
Could you possibly find something to back this up in SCOTUS decisions or the Constitution? 'Cause I keep seeing people asserting that FISA is unconstitutional, even though five Presidents have failed to take it to the Supreme Court to be overturned. Perhaps that's because Article I explicitly gives Congress rulemaking authority over military activity. God, you people and your absolutely unlimited commander-in-chief nonsense. Even the Roman Republic only allowed a dictator to serve for six months.
--mds
Let me guess, Al voted for invasion of privacy before he voted against it...
ReplyDeleteThis morning I posted more detail on SCOTUS and Clinton era privacy issues at my blog here.
We cats walk by ourselves.
ReplyDeleteYou homo sapiens need a leash or something to make you feel secure? What's the matter with you? You say you're superior to every other animal, and yet you all cower before some guy in cowboy boots???
Jeesh! Show some self-respect!!
Let me guess, Al voted for invasion of privacy before he voted against it...
ReplyDeleteAs Vice President? When did he cast the tie-breaking Senate vote in favor of invasion of privacy?
As a Senator? Which votes of his are you referring to?
As a Congressman? Mr. Gore voted in favor of FISA.
Oh, wait, that's right, it's all Bill Clinton's doing...again. I would like to join with the fly in demanding that President Clinton be impeached and removed from office for his crimes against our civil liberties...which are currently being used to justify the current President breaking the law. Wait, this gets confusing: Clinton did lots of evil stuff, and we will invoke him as precedent for the evil stuff we're doing. But when we do it, our shit smells like roses.
--mds
--mds
-- mds
ReplyDeleteFirst of all, I respect everyone's point of view here and I have a lot to say on the subject, but I'm sure our host doesn't want people taking over the comments section with lengthy right wing manifestos.
For that reason my post above provides a link to my Blog with more detail on my opinion, and references. That said, my point is that the Supreme Court has reviewed a few Clinton era privacy cases in favor of warrant less searches, not "Clinton did it too".
Meoooow! Filled with curiousity, I just strolled over to The Dog's blog which it turns out is right next door to The Fly's blog!
ReplyDeleteNo wonder they keep telling us to look at their blogs. Nobody does! They are lonely bloggers. None of The Fly's favorites of his own posts has any comments! A few of The Dog's posts have comments, but those comments are all The Fly's!
I sure hope they learn to write better and pick up some readers so they will stop annoying us over here so much. A cat can't get a good nap with all that bow wow wowing!
(I know I had trouble learning to tap out thoughts with my paws too, but don't be discouraged The Dog, it's doable!)
Anyway, I picked up a few fleas over there and now I have to go find my buddy The Tabby to help me with some behind-the-neck grooming before these insects install themselves permanently.
Meow, meow, meow!!
To The Cat:
ReplyDeleteThanks for visting my Blog. I would have been interested in your comments on my MLK post, assuming you are capable of making serious comments.
I'm a big cat lover myself, so if you get tired of using Glenn's blog as your kitty box, come on over and drop a few of your Baby Ruth's at my blog. If you stay here too long, Glenn is going to have to change the litter lest the place begins to stink just a bit.
I enjoy a spirited discussion, and would like to see all types of viewpoints expressed in the comments section. Again I am assuming you are capable of actually expressing viewpoints.
So far all we know for sure is that you know how to dig around in the box, but are still working on covering up before you leave it. I would have been far more impressed by some form of meaningful commentary about anything that I have said, whether here or there.
My Blog isn't even a month old, I'm still learning how to program the dang thing. Quality takes a little time. Its a work in progress, and still needs a lot of improvement. I did think my MLK post was my best effort to date. I only posted a couple paragraphs of it here.
Well I'll let you get back to licking the toe jam from between where your claws used to be.
Says the "Dog"
That said, my point is that the Supreme Court has reviewed a few Clinton era privacy cases in favor of warrant less searches, not "Clinton did it too".
ReplyDeleteCould you compromise, and simply cite the names of the cases, for those of us too lazy to follow the link? Or just pick a few representative ones, if there are too many? Because digging into the nitty-gritty of SCOTUS decisions and our system of checks and balances in these comments is much more welcome than the rabid barkings of a "dog".
--mds
I've been really enjoying this blog except for the behavior of a few posters. You know, you spend a good deal of time constructing what you hope will be a cogent post, and then someone you don't know comes along and treats you like a fire hydrant. It's disheartening - maybe that is the purpose. I don't know.
ReplyDeleteThe first virtual community I ever participated in enforced strict standards - you needed a password to get in, and if you violated community standards, you got thrown out. You also used your real name, which meant you were standing behind your own words.
The optimist and editor in me says that if these characters would eliminate the insults and scatological references and threadworn talking points, and focus instead on figuring out what they are really trying to say and saying it as well as they can, people might start taking them more seriously, as they periodically ask people to do, and they'd improve their writing skills, and and and...positive feedback loop.
The pessimist says they're hopeless. In any case it's harder to enforce community standards out in the blogosphere than in a private forum, I'm not sure how you'd do it, as I've never tried running my own blog.
I've been really enjoying this blog except for the behavior of a few posters. You know, you spend a good deal of time constructing what you hope will be a cogent post, and then someone you don't know comes along and treats you like a fire hydrant.
ReplyDeleteAgreed. I simply ignore a few people, left and right, if they evince only an interest in urinating on others and/or never-ending promotion of their own blogs.
I've served as a moderator, and moderated fora have their drawbacks; I ended up quitting because I was convinced one of the others was exercsing his authority along partisan lines, and it really made me angry. Further, policing is time consuming, and there are also legal reasons, as odd as it sounds, why it can be safer not to moderate.
All in all, I think ignoring cretins is the best way. I just do not reply to them; the adults should simply proceed with their discussion.
Well people,
ReplyDeleteAfter reading Mr. Gore's entire speech, I found three paragraphs that seem to be conspicuously absent from Left leaning commentary.
One includes this phrase that supports my theory on constitutional authority "there is in fact an inherent power conferred by the Constitution to the President to take unilateral action when necessary".
As I have been trying to point out, the Constitution does not contemplate injecting federal judges into the president's decision making process.
Oh, too slow, the fly, too slooow.
ReplyDeleteThat one's been making the rounds for some time already. Let's finish that section of the speech, shall we?
But the existence of that inherent power cannot be used to justify a gross and excessive power grab lasting for many years and producing a serious imbalance in the relationship between the executive and the other two branches of government.
Jefferson noted that the President might sometimes act swiftly and unilaterally in what he perceives to be the best interests of the Republic, but must be willing to accept review and, if need be, punishment for his actions afterward. This is why the Constitution says he must "take care that the laws are faithfully executed", and doesn't say, "unless he alone decides otherwise."
I'm also interested (well, not that much: see hypatia's last comment above) in your answer to Mr. Gore's question:
Can it be true that any president really has such powers under our Constitution? If the answer is "yes" then under the theory by which these acts are committed, are there any acts that can on their face be prohibited? If the President has the inherent authority to eavesdrop on American citizens without a warrant, imprison American citizens on his own declaration, kidnap and torture, then what can't he do?
Congress cannot impinge upon his Commander-in-Chief powers, even with their Constitutionally-granted power to determine the rules and regulations governing the military. The judiciary, as you note, is forbidden to interfere with his Commander-in-Chief function in any way. So what is left? We just trust the President to do what's right? I know that's one of the arguments that Mr. Bush has used, that the check on his power comes entirely from his taking the oath of office. Forgive me if I fail to see any checks and balances here. Oh, but in other matters, the Founders meant for the Executive to be checked. Just not in his unlimited authority over a standing military. Okay.
--mds
--mds
ReplyDeleteThat's a fair question. The popular myth is that the Bush administration is overselling the "war on terror" to consolidate power, but Mr. Gore himself also said "the threat of additional terror strikes is real and the concerted efforts by terrorists to acquire weapons of mass destruction does indeed create a real imperative to exercise the powers of the Executive Branch with swiftness and agility".
Is it reasonable to conclude that when the Bush administration warns us of terrorists it's just a political ploy, while Mr. Gore's speech including similar warnings is revered? And who would determine what defensive measures are appropriate if not the president? Are you suggesting that Congress should be reviewing the day to day decisions on defending the nation?
Are you suggesting that Congress should be reviewing the day to day decisions on defending the nation?
ReplyDeleteNot necessarily in real time, but yep. It's called oversight, necessary because men are not angels, nor governed by them. Alternatively, if it pertains to foreign intelligence surveillance, the President can comply with FISA, and get a retroactive warrant for those cases where FISA requires a warrant. No, this is not an onerous burden. And yes, Mr. Gore acknowledges the threat of terrorism, and the need to respond swiftly. He also rejects the premise that the executive is thus perpetually unaccountable to any other branch of government. There is the difference.
Mr. Gore is also not "Commander-in-Chief" of the United States, using the threat of terrorism to insist that his executive powers be completely unrestrained, save by himself. Mr. Gore's warnings of terrorism are cast thusly: There is a real threat; the threat must be responded to swiftly when necessary; but we should not let fear lead us to surrender liberties and our system of checks and balances. When the Executive Branch demands more power while invoking "mushroom clouds," it is profiting from the politics of fear. Fear is addressed in Mr. Gore's speech; I recommend that section as well. In fact, I recommend reading through the whole thing, rather than excerpting fragments to twist it into a defense of the unilateral executive.
--mds
Fly, excellent point about Gore's statements regarding the real threat of terrorism.
ReplyDeleteSays the "Dog"
--mds
ReplyDelete"When the Executive Branch demands more power while invoking "mushroom clouds," it is profiting from the politics of fear."
Actually, the "mushroom clouds" reference was about Iraq, not terrorists. The phrase Bush uses is "weapons of mass murder". Nice try though...
Whitehouse website.
Actually, the "mushroom clouds" reference was about Iraq, not terrorists. The phrase Bush uses is "weapons of mass murder". Nice try though...
ReplyDeleteWait, so the Bush administration doesn't really believe that Saddam Hussein wanted to give nuclear weapons to terrorists? My world has just come crashing down.
Other than that, I withdraw my criticism. The Bush administration engaged in fearmongering about Iraq, not about all the terrorists with "close ties" to Iraq. Those wolves in that television commercial were Iraqi wolves, made to run through the woods over there so they can't run through the woods over here.
--mds