I ended my previous post on Michelle Malkin's "salute" to "Coultermania" with a promise to explain why such things merit a response, which is what I intend to do here. The topic is one I find difficult to narrow down (and compose a decent entry on in a day), so I might ramble a bit. Please bear with me.
As Glenn noted yesterday, the primary reason to respond to Malkin, Coulter, Hannity, et all is that they are influential. Let me try and put a personal face on that reason.
Not too long ago a friend of mine told me she was trying to become more politically informed. To do so, she continued, she had begun reading Ann Coulter's How to Talk to a Liberal (If You Must). Think about that for a moment. This was an individual who did not know much about politics, was a non-ideological independent and the first person she could think of to learn more about politics from was a hate-mongering hack. This should have never happened, because Coulter should have been exposed for the vile, bigoted, intellectually bankrupt propagandist that she is by journalists a long time ago. In this regard, my friend was failed by a mainstream media which is more interested in using Coulter as a figure to drive up ratings than they are in doing their jobs of promoting a responsible national discourse.
This is why I respond to Coulter and her apologists like Malkin, because I don't want their hate corrupting people like my friend. In the comments of Glenn's post, I linked to this entry I had previously written about why eliminationist rhetoric is not a joke as an explanation of why I write about extremists. You'll notice that it contains a link to a post that Alonzo Fyfe wrote after his wife was sent an e-mail from a co-worker which fantasized about the deaths of liberals. The co-worker thought it "too good not to pass along."
We must answer Coulter and her ilk, because unanswered their hateful rhetoric creeps into society, meant to divide us from our friends, family, and fellow Americans. The reason these pundits are incapable of disagreeing with someone without first labeling an opponent as liberal, Democrat, socialist, far left, moonbat, communist etc. (and the same can go for those who do the reverse) is because their tribal binary logic requires them to identify an outgroup, a "them" to be excluded, or worse, eliminated. This is why Glenn discovered that he was a "leftist" and/or a "liberal" for his opposition to the Bush administration. Sarcastically explaining this tactic, Glenn wrote
[T]hey label the argument and the person making it "leftist" and "liberal" and - presto! - no more need to address the arguments or consider its substance because it’s all been shooed away with one fell swoop of name-calling cliches.In a post commenting on this I noted that the name-calling tactic is actually a common propaganda technique. The Propaganda Critic website describes name-calling thusly:
The name-calling technique links a person, or idea, to a negative symbol. The propagandist who uses this technique hopes that the audience will reject the person or the idea on the basis of the negative symbol, instead of looking at the available evidence.To which I added that this tactic is facilitated by the line of books demonizing "liberals" and it is often coupled with eliminationism, because "the more the symbol, with all its negative associations comes to represent the group, the less that the group is perceived as human, the easier it is to rationalize injustice committed towards the group." The rhetoric of these media transmitters, both by repackaging extremist views for mainstream consumption and by engaging in the ritual defamation of those with whom they disagree, serve to shift mainstream political discourse towards the extreme. I'm passing over this subject briefly but will direct your attention to Dave Neiwert's seminal essay Rush, Newspeak, and Fascism: An exegesis (from which the transmitters link is taken) which exhaustively explains why and how American values are being transformed and corrupted by the right-wing extremism that the likes of Coulter and Malkin help to diffuse into every day discussion.
As a quick example of the process of transmission, let's look at Malkin for a case in point. Michelle claims that conservatives "zealously police their own ranks" to guard against extremism. I already wrote a post about her apologetics for Coulter's extremism, but what about Malkin herself? Does she transmit extremist views? Yes, she does. As Alex Koppelman has noted, Malkin keeps in her blogroll VDare.com, an organization that has been identified by the Southern Poverty Law Center as a hate group with ties to white supremacism and which runs Malkin's syndicated columns.* The interesting thing about Koppelman's link is that he frames his post with a rant from Bill O'Reilly about how "far left" extremists are allowed on television to push their views but right-wing extremists like the KKK aren't, followed by O'Reilly bringing on Michelle Malkin who gives extremist views a soft face for palatable mainstream consumption . This is a microcosm of the way in which our media legitimizes right-wing extremism. Which brings me back to Coulter.
The fact that Coulter is on tv in the first place means that something is seriously wrong with our society. Peter Daou, who called Coulter's appearance on the Tonight Show "a dangerous inflection point in American politics," recognizes the absurdity of having a hate-mongering bigot like Coulter on, but he shied away from making the "obvious comparisons." The obvious comparisons need to be made. So here it is: Coulter talks about "liberals" the way racists talk about blacks, the way the Nazis talked about Jews. Her "jokes" are predicated on the notion that the elimination of a set of humans are funny, her "jokes" are funny the way anti-Semitic "jokes" like this were funny, which is to say, they are not not funny. They are disgusting and deadly serious.
In the clip of her appearance on the Tonight Show, Coulter mentioned that she let her "smartest liberal friend" whom she told would be "smarter than any liberal I'm going to be on tv with" read her book. Could her bigotry be any plainer? Substitute in any other group that's been hated against in history and see how that sentence sounds.
Yet, Coulter, a hypocrite who has written a book called Slander (denouncing "liberals" as liars) and who now unequivocally states that Bill Clinton being a rapist is a "universally accepted fact" can get a whitewash piece in Time magazine, one of the largest American news publications. Why is this woman on television and syndicated across the nation? Strip away her petty insults and what is left? What does she contribute to the national dialogue other than hate? Are we to believe Godless is an answer to A Theory of Justice by John Rawls?
This woman who has the nerve to assert that God endorses her politics alone has apparently never read Exodus 20:16: "Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor." She asserts that "liberals" are "godless". Apparently, Jimmy Carter, possibly the most devout President in US history, didn't get the memo. She asserts that evolution is a "liberal" religion which has no evidence supporting it. Scientists beg to differ.
So what does it say about us as a culture that Ann Coulter can occupy the national stage? The Green Knight, a liberal Christian blogger, answers
Only a society that has ceased to value that reasonable context of discussion (in other words, only a society that no longer really cares about itself) could enthusiastically make significant room for someone like Coulter, who rakes in profits by making up lies and "entertaining" people by demanding the deaths of those she hates. And American society today makes room not only for her, but also for an entire right-wing movement for which eliminationist rhetoric has become the norm. This is a society that no longer trusts itself, that is incapable of seeing its citizens as citizens and therefore as worthy of respect.So it behooves us to answer and expose Coulter's puerile drivel so long as our national media continues to legitimize her and her compatriots.This isn't a partisan issue, it's a human decency issue, as principled conservatives recognize. If we want to stop the rot of our democratic institutions, then we must counter the putrid rhetoric of Coulter, Malkin, and company which acts as corrosive acid dissolving the bonds of our democratic society, dividing the country into "Us" versus "Them".
*Correction - I had previously said Malkin wrote for VDare. That's not the case, they run her syndicated column.
UPDATE: To further highlight the necessity of responding to Coulter and co., take a close look at the Spinsanity article I provided above (the hate-mongering hack link). It was written in 2001, and begins by lamenting:
It then goes on to expose, step-by-step, the formulaic "rhetorical manipulation" that Coulter uses in her work. You can see in that article that they had already addressed what would comprise the next five years of Coulter's writings. But look at the closing paragraph (bold emphasis mine)
The last few years have witnessed the emergence of a new class of pundits. Many, regrettably, are prodigies in the aggressive political jargon that pervades our political discourse.
Why is Coulter so important? Even though most people haven't heard of her, she and other relatively young jargon-slingers like David Limbaugh and Michelle Malkin are gaining stature. As a result, the rise of aggressive political jargon is likely to continue, with predictable and pernicious consequences for American political discourse.That was in 2001. Plenty of people have heard of Coulter and the "relatively young jargon-slingers" now. Ignoring them does not work.
100% correct.
ReplyDeleteThe Republican noise machine must be confronted. After the 2004 election, my brother asked his 11-year-old son and his 10 year old daughter who they favored. John Kerry or George Bush. They both quickly said President George Bush. He asked them why? They both said, this needs to be taken seriously, that President Bush believed in God and John Kerry did not. This is what the Republican noise machine does.
Nothing else needs to be added!
www.whereistheoutrage.net
Unfortunatly everyone participates in the process of dividing the world into us vs them's.
ReplyDeleteThe difference being that they wish death on their enemies. I on the other hand just wish my enemies would STFU!
It's an interesting thing. In a good world, people like Coulter could be ignored. Hatred would get ignored because it's ugly.
ReplyDeleteNow, it's not that ugly, as long as it's directed at the right people.
And what gets me about this is that it's not even *honest* hatred.
I mean, if you want to hate me for saying gay folks should be allowed to get married, that the killing of tens of thousands of innocent people is wrong, unless it's the only way to prevent some imminent threat that's even worse, that workers should earn a decent wage, and so forth, hey, that's great. Hate me for those things. Hate me for "tying the President's hands" so he can't torture people, and can't kidnap people and hold them without showing just cause to hold them. Hate me for what I am, and I don't like it, but hey, I can deal with it.
What I can't deal with, and what makes these tactics such a massive betrayal of the everyday folks on the right, is that hatred generated by lies and distortion.
There's nothing I want more than to open their eyes, and see just how badly some folks on the right are playing them for fools and filling them with hateful lies.
So much verbage when all you had to say was:
ReplyDeleteCUZ SHE'S A SKANK!
So here's the question we've wrestling with for the past several days:
ReplyDeletePrecisely *how* do we deflate, depower, or otherwise reduce the stature of these (dim) luminaries to the point where they and their bile are sufficiently toxic they won't be heeded?
Sorry to be OT, but is it just my old(er) eyes or did the font size suddenly get larger after
ReplyDelete"Yet, Coulter, a hypocrite who has written a book called Slander..."
?
Since I find it somewhat risky to give too much attention to Coutler, since for her any publicity is good publicity, these two posts on the subject are of special interest.
ReplyDeleteThis post, more so than Glenn's which also focused on the point, was particularly concerned about the failure of media (this includes the commentariat) to expose her. Instead, they put on on Leno.
This seems to me not directly addressed to Ann. It is more a problem with media, Ann second. Similiarly, to focus on Glenn's post, the fact that BushCo (e.g., Mary Matalin) is not put to task for joining hands with Coulteresque discourse. Again, the proper target ultimately is these groups.
The only reason solely addressed to Coutler et. al. is the fact that they have a wide audience. The core audience is probably much smaller -- their numbers are raised because of cynical alliances with mainstream (sic) Bushites. Still, they have a suitable audience, and must be answered.
But, for instance, the reason why your friend here went to Ann is not because she is just one of many "voices." No, it is that the media and Bushco has accepted her as a "legitimate" voice. If she was just some hate proponent, it would matter less.
No, it is the fact others use her, which she thrives upon, as do others such as Mickey Kaus etc. This, I think, should be remembered here.
"Sorry to be OT, but is it just my old(er) eyes or did the font size suddenly get larger after"
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't doubt it. When I went to post it I got an error that there is an open font tag somewhere. I'll see what I can do.
Great post. You are exactly right that the reason she has to be addressed is because she's influential. And it's not true that any publicity is good publicity. (If life were that simple, PR people wouldn't have jobs.)
ReplyDeleteYou would think her comments about the 9/11 widows taking joy in their husbands' deaths would put her beyond the pale for any "mainstream" media. This should be the point of attack: how can people like Jay Leno and Bill Maher keep giving her a platform for her to spread hate? I think part of why they do it is because they don't take her seriously. It's a subtle sexism: if she's a hot blonde woman, then it's OK for her to espouse murder, because she'll never be influential. And yet she is, and needs to be smacked down (metaphorically).
The problem in dealing with Coulter is that Americans no longer (if they ever did) understand argument. And they don't care. The appeal to emotion or the ad hominem argument works just fine for them, thank you very much. This has been the problem with every democracy since Alcibiades tried to seduce the people of Athens.
ReplyDeleteAnnie knows this so she doesn't bother her pretty little head with making sense. She is well aware that we have pretty much reached the bread and circuses stage where the vile leadership panders to the masses, flattering them by calling them patriots or people of faith or whatever works, while ensuring that they have convenient scapegoats for kicking. All the while robbing them blind via the tax code, lying to them at will, and laughing at them behind closed doors.
So reasoned argument is unlikely to work. Not that there is not a place for it --- it's just that it probably won't be appreciated for what it is until years from now. Glen's book will probably sell more in 50 years than it has today.
Satire on the other hand has a prayer of working in the here and now. Coulter is a figure of fun; she is ridiculous on so many levels. So use the pen as a skewer when it comes to her and Malkin.
We need Swift more than Locke at this point.
Expend the real mental energy on demonstrating to Americans that they have no way of knowing if their votes count. Americans may not like to follow a reasoned argument, but convince them that they have been ripped off in some way and they sit up and pay attention.
Reason's Cathy Young on Crude and Unusual: Why Ann Coulter isn't a national treasure
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteThe fact of the matter of what we need to face is that racism and xenophobia are alive and well and are a part of human nature.
ReplyDeleteCoulter and her ilk have taken that fact and exploited it to their advantage. Believe it or not there's a large group of people in this country who actually feel that they are oppressed because their freedom-to-hate has been abrigded. That's why the phrase "PC" has managed to evolve into a profanity. Ann speaks for those people.
Again, I'm short on actual plans for action, but I'm hoping I'm shining a bit of light on the subject.
Coulter...is the Jerry Springer of political discourse...
ReplyDeleteMalkin. Limbaugh.. the rest.. its all Jerry Springer TV ...
yankeependragon said...
ReplyDeleteSo here's the question we've wrestling with for the past several days:
Precisely *how* do we deflate, depower, or otherwise reduce the stature of these (dim) luminaries to the point where they and their bile are sufficiently toxic they won't be heeded?
This problem has now become that classic Catch 22. Money is being made off of hate. Any response to the hate makes for more money and allows another round of hate, which makes for more money and another round of hate.
It is a child's game or a fools game. The child and the fool don't see the potential futility and/or they don't care for what ever reason. Only a person of a higher authority (usually a parent) can stop the game.
In this case, we don't seem to have a parent. Even the fact that the controlling political faction in their religious brand functions from a strong father figure model speaks to the catch in this game. Their father's words are interpreted as permission and even praise for such behavior. Thus, we can not even count on their own father to stop this. Of course to rely on such would just prove we have lost our minds too.
The use of law as the parent is waning as a result of the particular theocratic philosophy of the current political power block: they are the only true adult/parent next to God and thus need no laws.
The only real parent is money. If we are going to stop the hate, we have to stop the money flowing to and from it. You stop the money, by cutting it off or redirecting it. I can think of a few ways, but there is no quick means. No, we have to start thinking more long term, we need to creat a setup. Just as a set up was created for the moment of Bush.
But here are a few thoughts:
1. Make a fairness doctrine priority after we capture the congress,
2. Start getting real about the internet's potential as the ultimate MSM and parlay the current bag of independent progressive/liberal blog's into a united financial force of MSM.
3. Work to make people happy again by solving their problem: money (happy people don't find a need to hate),
4. Form a venture capitol company and start building a media conglomerate. There was 49% of almost 300 million people who did not vote for Bush et al. This is a highly under served customer base. Do it with the net, radio and print.
5. Advertise: Feel sick today, you can blame Ann for that. Feel like you want to hit someone, you can blame Rush for that, Feeling like they're all the same, you can blame Bill for that. Don't know what the truth is anymore, you can blame Fox for that.
6. Start your next conversation with: What's wrong with just being nice to each other? You'll be amazed at how many people will immediately have a reason for what's wrong with it. Then you can ask them again, Yes, but what is wrong with just being nice to each other. It'll take you asking about 4 or more times before the person sees what they have become as they realize what they have been answering instead of just answering with the word - Nothing.
7. Work to remove the "personhood" from the concept of what a corporation is
8. Smile and be happy when you are conversing to change someone's point of view such as Ann's or Bill's or Rush. Do not take them or what they say personally. They can't someone being nice to them that they expected other wise from.
9. Point out what other countries have built actual real walls along their boarders
10. Fight locally to return public education back to servicing societies needs and not corporate labor needs,
Hume, I want to thank you and Glenn for staying with this line of discussion and debate concerning the deception and lies of the Right and its pundits. It's helped me focus my thoughts on this very important issue that really does point up the threat posed by the Right to what has been called liberal democracy. (This, of course, does not refer to the Liberals and their assumptions only but refers to the great revolutionary idea behind the founding of this country. In this sense, Lincoln and others were liberal democrats.)
ReplyDeleteWhat has struck me about the rhetoric used by the Right is its spitefulness and ugliness. I find it telling that the Right accuses the Left of being angry, as though that were a profane emotion. As you and Glenn have pointed out, anger is not an unreasonable emotion in many contexts, especially the field of political debate. Yet, the Right has attempted to stigmatize anger as though it is something unreasonable and ultimately unethical. As Martha Nussbaum has pointed out, however, it is anger at injustice and wrong that forms much of the underlying basis for the legal system.
I allude to Nussbaum not only to use her authority in supporting your wiring about anger, I also think that her recent work on disgust, shame, and the law (Hiding from Humanity: Disgust, Shame, and the Law) can give some insight into the rhetorical tactics currently used by the Right.
To shorten this comment, I'll simply provide a quote from Nussbaum that I believe explains the emotion that the Right hopes to exploit in its political strategy. This emotion is disgust. Nussbaum quotes conservative bioethicist Leon Kass, who head Pres. Bush's commission that examines the ethical issues surrounding stem-cell research:
According to Kass, there is a "wisdom" in our sentiment of "repugnance," a wisdom that lies beneath all rational argument. When we contemplate certain prospects, we are disgusted "because we intuit and feel, immediately and without argument, the violation of things that we rightfully hold dear." Repugnance "revolts against the excesses of human willfulness, warning us not to transgress what is unspeakably profound." Kass admits that "[r]evulsion is not argument," but he thinks that it gives us access to a level of the personality that is in some ways deeper and more reliable than argument. "In crucial cases...repugnance is the emotional expression of deep wisdom."
Now Nussbaum wants to show that recent legal cases by conservatives have attempted to make disgust a legal criterion. She argues that it's an invalid criterion for various reasons. She also explain how disgust lies at the root of homophobia, anti-Semitism, and violence against women.
Be that as it may, how this relates to Coulter et al, is in how their rhetoric is an expression of disgust. At the same time that it expresses the author's disgust with numerous subjects, it also hopes to elicit in the reader a sense of disgust. The theory behind this rhetoric follows Kass in his belief that disgust is a truer and more authentic basis for morality and ethics (and by extension the law) than rational argument.
If the preceding is true, then we can say that Coulter, Limbaugh, et al hope to forestall rational debate and discussion and evoke what they perceive as moral sentiments that in some way are truer to reality than reason. In this sense, then, it is inaccurate to call Coulter's work an exercise in hate or anger but rather a rhetoric of disgust.
For a radio interview with Nussbaum where she discusses her work on disgust and the law, see this site.
I work for local government. I attend many meetings with the public, staff, and elected officials. One of the many ironies of all of this that if anyone showed up in a public forum making such charges against their opponents, they would only be severely ostracized, but if any elected officials were present, armed security would likely be immediately be called. It blows my mind in so many ways that anyone would give this...being...a forum of any kind. For anyone in the MSM to do so reflects a desperation to attract eyeballs (and to inflate such numbers to justify ad rates), and a complete failure to present anything other than outrageous statements from a carefully groomed bombthrower.
ReplyDeleteIn fact, now that I think about it a bit more, what's the difference between an Anne Coulter, who was deliberately chosen, groomed, and marketed to be an agent provocateur, and a terrorist who came up through an Islamist madrasah? Both tools are intended to foster fear and hostility. Yes, the terrorist may kill people, but it is only a matter of time before Coulter's books and statements incite a killing, IMHO.
Yes but you must also see that Coulter sells herself as a comedy act, which is how Leno treats her. Lets not forget that racist comedy was a staple of vaudeville and in many ways Coulter is merely a vaudevillian selling the same racial mocking comedy that the blackface performers did. This is how Leno and Chris Matthews can then make jokes about Coulter's looks -- it's par for the course in a Friar's roast if not in a political discussion.
ReplyDeleteThe way to fight the hate mongers is not to parry their charges with logic and fact (as Greenwald and the others here often do) but through reverse mocking and ridicule.
I've written about this on DK as well: This is a schoolyard fight. Mocking and ridicule win the day. Arguing logically means you've already lost the crowd.
The return fire must be in the form of personal ridicule not logical construct.
I hate to say it, but it's the only way you win a fight like this.
-- WinSmith
Sure HG, but aren't both Glen and yourself in danger of doing exactly what Coulter et. al. are doing - namely characterizing your political opponents as immoral. It's the moralization of politics which has derailed political discourse in America - exactly what McCarthy attempted in the 50s.
ReplyDeleteBy all means point out the errors of their ways, but don't get into a shouting match with them. In the end they have to be marginalized, not because they disagree with us, but because they are not engaged in serious political debate. You can't debate them, so why bother?
'nuf said' said:
ReplyDelete"Coulter talks about "liberals" the way racists talk about blacks, the way the Nazis talked about Jews"
Humes Ghost said:
"Jokes" that are funny the way racists think "jokes" about how inferior other races are funny. "Jokes" that are funny the way KKK members think "jokes" about lynching black people are funny.
Jokes about lynching are exactly the right comparison for the 'humor' of Coulter and her ilk. The KKK, Aryan Nation, neo-Nazis, skinheads etc. can't really believe blacks don't laugh at jokes about lynching because they don't have a sense of humor, and it's not just a matter of good-ol-boys being a little un-PC while reminiscing about ol' Dixie. Those jokes carry a threat, and are intended to intimidate. That's one of the functions of conservative pundits which is often overlooked. It may not be a physical threat, although Coulter is certainly trying to make it that, but it is a threat that if we try to express our values in public we will be ridiculed and humiliated. Of course, along with the threat there is always the advice from 'helpful' conservatives that if we just mind our manners, know our place and don't get uppity or anything, maybe we won't be kicked off the bus entirely. Decades of constant derision with no answer has all but convinced liberals and progressives to defeat themselves, saving reactionaries the trouble.
ecthompson said:
They both said, this needs to be taken seriously, that President Bush believed in God and John Kerry did not.
The difference between liberals and conservatives when it comes to religion can be described by one word: orthodoxy. For conservatives, believing in God means submitting to the authority of people who claim to be in possession of the ultimate truth and speak for God. When liberals reject the orthodoxy that is heresy. When they assert the right to determine the truth for themselves, that is tantamount to rejecting God, because conservatives are unable to distinguish between spirituality and orthodoxy.
fighting foo said:
It is interesting how people get suck in when certain worlds are used like family, god, or church.
aj said:
The problem in dealing with Coulter is that Americans no longer (if they ever did) understand argument. And they don't care.
If there is one thing we need to understand to explain why conservatives win the 'debate' no matter how wrong they are it is this: People do not want to sort through the facts to determine who has the right values; they want to be told who has the right values so they know who's facts to believe.
Calling them liars and attacking their 'facts' is a pointless battle of attrition and a futile game of logical whack-a-mole unless we first gain the moral high ground. Making it an issue of human decency is exactly the right approach.
well said, but in the end, Coulter, Malkin, Rush, etc. are merely symptoms of a far larger cancer in American society. A significant segment of our country support them. Silence one, another one will pop up. I don't know how we change our society to render them irrelevant, but unless we find a way, we're just playing Wack-a-mole (and not succeeding).
ReplyDeleteWill it take a second Civil War to resolve this? I'm afraid it will.
"Sure HG, but aren't both Glen and yourself in danger of doing exactly what Coulter et. al. are doing - namely characterizing your political opponents as immoral."
ReplyDeleteI certainly am depicting Ann Coulter as immoral. I'm not a relatavist, sorry. Advocating for the death of people you disagree with IS immoral.
The return fire must be in the form of personal ridicule not logical construct.
ReplyDeleteI hate to say it, but it's the only way you win a fight like this.
It would be a pyrric victory if we had to sacrifice honest discourse and a devotion to the truth in order to counter Coulter.
"There is but one thing of value, to cultivate truth and justice, and to live without anger amidst lying and unjust men." - Emperor Marcus Aurelius
btw Huffington Post has a good post on her appearance on Leno, suggesting George Carlin appreciated her "act."
ReplyDeleteI really don't think taking her personally as so seem to do really is productive. "Oh, how horrible" is really a waste of energy.
Right, Dr. Cameron?
For anyone that finds Shooter's objection compelling, here is Alonzo's parsing of the "friendly" e-mail.
ReplyDeleteI'm not in favor of spreading Coulteritis (an infection that will never go away until people stop talking about her). She does not deserve the attention. Every time someone else posts about her, she has achieved what she set out to achieve: get liberals to shift attention away from issues that matter and focus on an issue that doesn't matter at all: Ann Coulter.
ReplyDelete""The return fire must be in the form of personal ridicule not logical construct.
ReplyDeleteI hate to say it, but it's the only way you win a fight like this.
It would be a pyrric victory if we had to sacrifice honest discourse and a devotion to the truth in order to counter Coulter.""
You are both right - you can do both, and they are not inconsistent nor are you sacrificing honest discourse.
Hume,
Most of what you said in your fantastic and extremely important post (hint, UT readers, send to all media outlets) was right on. it is irresponsible/intolerable that the media partakes of this, and that is a big part of the problem, and has to be repeateadly communicated this way.
you make that point with facts. but what coulter (and others) do is somehow turn being liberal into something uncool.
I noted yesterday (got mocked by a leftist hater who called right wingers, "vermin," incidentally) that many peolpe are democrats, dont know it, and just have this negative association with liberals because they have been for the most part so mischaracterized.
that can not only be fought with facts, unless people wanted to focus first on facts and second, on who appeals to them. and they don't.
ridicule per se is wrong. but illustrating coulter for who she is, EFFECTIVELY, is not. (or right wing extremists (as per Glenn's post yesterday) for engaging in constant distortions --they either can't comprehend the issues correctly, or they manipulate them. both are bad.))
I called and wrote to the center for American progress about their big cake/float wash the ann coulter doll's mouth out with soap (or whatever it was that they were doing exactly, it was something similar). Not because they were ridiculing her, but because they were doing so in a way that would not connect with anybody but those who already got it, and if anything, would make them look petty.
another example. calling her a skank is counterproductive, no matter how satisfying. come up with something that nails the essence of what she does, in a way that MOST people would grasp, and that therefor is not dishonest, but that makes the case in a way that puts her in her place. I'm not good at "burn" contests so I leave it to those more so gifted. but a bad example, just to get it going: "a snake in the garden radical extremist who poses as a believer in democracy, while at the same time crucifying - and worse, the very essence of democracy, the need to have differing opinions."
see, not so good, but a start, because it would not turn off as much of America to one's message as calling her "skank" does. (and if enough people continue to say it to a broad enough audience, it takes hold. that's the republican strategy. a message that people identy with, then complete and total saturation.)
coulter, and the right, connects with those who havent already "got" whatever it is they are trying to push. democrats haven't so far.
not saying that accomplishing this is easy. but the first and most significant step is recognizing the democrats have not effectively done it (whether it be communicating a message, illustrating how the other side has misrepresented, defining themselves, or illustgrating the reynolds, the malkins, the coulters -- three different things -- for what they are, and reducing their disproportionately large impact accordingly.
at the same time, I want to emphasize that the media is DISGUSTING, REPREHENSIBLE, (and TIME magazine is a joke that should be ostracized by ALL patriotic Americans) for having on or giving time to a "a snake in the garden radical extremist who poses as a believer in democracy, while at the same time crucifying - and worse -- the very essence of democracy, the need to have differing opinions" and pretend she is something different.
And by the way, Sean hannity, though he is much more earnest and truly believes almost everything he says (some people are born natural totalitarians, just into democratic societies) is not that far off either. He wrote a best seller which, by the title, says it all:
Deliver Us from Evil: Defeating Terrorism, Despotism, and Liberalism. The fact that the title itself being totalitarian, is not aparently evident to enough Americans, illustrates that the case needs to be much more effectively, and much more strongly made.
ps To read the Intro to Nussbaum's book, see this site.
ReplyDeleteIvan,
ReplyDeleteI agree one can do both. Here's a perfect example.
In fact there is concern for the subject's welfare because she is now personally liable for her views..
ReplyDeleteThis reminds me of something Instapundit said not to long ago, first he quoted this passage;
The real danger is that we who support the war will reach the point that we say "we might as well be taken as wolves then as sheep". At that point the left can celebrate that they have made our military and those who support it the people they claim we are. Once that happens however any compunction about respecting them will be gone, and remember one side is armed and one is not. That is a fate that I don't wish on any of us
And then added, "neither do I."
The tone of Shooter and Instapundit is the same. Terrible things might happen to "liberals", and Shooter and Instapundit might feel bad about it happening to them, but "liberals" brought it on themselves.
I was about to go to bed and decided to turn in after reading your post about Coulter/Malkin, and suddenly, I was wide awake, partly angry and partly riveted by the need to produce a poem based on this incredible post!
ReplyDeleteI will do so now and link back to you my friend.
Peace.
Sure HG, but aren't both Glen and yourself in danger of doing exactly what Coulter et. al. are doing - namely characterizing your political opponents as immoral. It's the moralization of politics which has derailed political discourse in America - exactly what McCarthy attempted in the 50s.
ReplyDeleteActually, no.
Coulter, at least, isn't actually making any political argument. An argument is a connected series of statements to establish a definite proposition. Coulter's statements are just abuse, and should be treated as such.
There is one best way to take away the forums that AC and MM utilize to spew their hatred, and that is e-mail campaigns. I am not talking about just the shows that have them on, but finding out the advertisers that broadcast during these shows and e-mailing them. Threats of boycotts against the sponsors will have greatest effects because then money is being threatened. Organize, get your friends and family involved and we can make a difference.
ReplyDeletePolite Liberal,
ReplyDeleteThat's exactly what I was saying - except that it's not simply "abuse" on their part but moral condemnation ("treason", "baby killers", etc). Politics should not be about morality; at least not in a democratic context. To argue that the political opposition is immoral is either (a) part of the usual political rhetoric; or (b) to argue that the opposition have no legitimate right to public office. Of course (b) is simply undemocratic; but the line between (a) and (b) is crossed every day by both sides of politics. It might be entertaining to watch but it renders serious political debate impossible. I don't think countering the conservatives with your own morally grounded accusations is the way to go - one has to break the cycle by addressing real political issues and leaving the destructive rhetoric behind.
I don't believe, though, that you can counter a non-argument with an argument, becuase the two statements are different in kind.
ReplyDeleteAn argument couched in abusive terms could plausibly be countered in the manner you suggest. Coulter, though, doesn't even go that far--her "arguments" are simply a chain of insults. Does she even propose policy?
About the best you can do with something like that is argue that modern conservatism is out of ideas, having amply demonstrated that their policies spectacularly fail when put into practice.
If you simply counter with a sane policy arguement (as you could if you were arguing with McCain, Specter, or some other conservative policymaker), you wind up with a "balance" between positions that looks like this:
Liberal: Our system of health care is collapsing. We should expand Medicare to cover the general population.
Coulter: Liberals are evil Stalinists. Communism failed in Russia, and it'll fail here.
Which do you think the media will give more play? If that's the "balance," note that the fulcrum is now at what would have been the ultraconservative position in the mid 1980s.
Again, Coulter isn't making an argument at all. You can't counter it with policy statements. You have two choices--insult in kind or use mockery.
I generally prefer the latter--liberals are generally better at wit than spleen.
I generally prefer the latter--liberals are generally better at wit than spleen.
ReplyDeleteLiberals can do anything conservatives do, and better. Including fight and die for their country and constitution, if necessary. They can even insult conservatives better, and have been doing so politely, because it's been called for, for years. Our insults are based in fact. It's a target rich environment.
“I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them.”
Adlai Stevenson
shooter242:
ReplyDelete"When was the moment liberals became so self-important that no one is allowed to laugh at you?"
shooter, PLEASE try to make sense. Believe me, I would love it if you could get over your self-importance, but that is neither here nor there.
Here we go again with the "no one is allowed" tripe. Why did you guys even start using that phrase? That statement doesn't mean what you think it means in that context.
I could ask you about why you don't get that traditional conservatives laugh at people like you behind your back, but then that would be changing the subject. You're an expert at using that tactic.
Keep in mind that the post was not about how people don't get funny jokes or satire. I'm sure you know that there are plenty of sane people (not necessarily liberal) that poke fun at the incoherency of conservative apparatchiks with blogs. You might want to check them out. They're pretty funny. But then again, maybe you wouldn't get the joke. You'd probably interpret it as some vicious attack on your intelliegence and complain about how you aren't being properly respected. Oh, it's so unfair, isn't it?
From shooter242 at 9:08AM:
ReplyDelete"When was the moment liberals became so self-important that no one is allowed to laugh at you?"
Probably around the same time conservatives (and you) became so self-conscious at the company you were keeping that you get *this* desperate to excuse the bile Coulter, Malkin, Hannity, Limbaugh, and their ilk are spewing on your behalf.
Whether spoken with conviction or in jest, there are things that are beyond the bounds of taste and good humor. Saying you 'regret the NY Times building hadn't been car bombed' (a paraphrase) or titling a book that claims despotism, terrorism, and liberalism are perfect equivalents is only marginally less offensive than looking at a black man who has been hanged and saying "The jig is up."
But then, I suppose ugly jokes like that are prefectly acceptable to you.
Shooter wrote: 'It's like the environmentalist that went to live with Grizzly bears, having extolled their virtues at length. The grizzly bears ate him. Now that's funny.'
ReplyDeleteShooter, this guy was mentally ill not an environmentalist. The fact that you find another human being being eaten alive funny says a great deal about the 'culture of life' that the idiot-W-and his followers trumpet. Hot air, a soundbite, alas no substance.
I'd suggest getting your facts straight, but also realize that facts are not important to the right.
Coulter has repeatedly advocated terrorist acts.
ReplyDeleteGood thing she's not on the left or someone would have noticed.
.
To shooter242 or any other fanboy -
ReplyDeleteIf Coulter, Limbaugh, and the rest are all speaking in fun and are not even remotely serious (as seems to be the contention), please explain why their screeds are under "Non-Fiction".
Whig,
ReplyDeleteThat was Instapundit quoting someone else. His comment was "neither do I"
Shooter, I followed the link and read the letter, and here's my thought: I don't get it.
ReplyDeleteIs a terrorist (in your mind) running loose in a liberal's home funny? Why?
Is the government washing its hands of Guantanamo detainees and laying the mess off on liberal citizens funny? Why?
Is the general idea of threatening liberals with terrorist attacks funny? Why?
In short, what's the joke? I'd love to be in on it, even if it's at my own expense. I love a good joke, so please explain it to me, because I'm stoopid.
(And while you're at it, maybe you could explain why you think civilian deaths are sometimes ok.)
Hm, a Hate Article, complaining how the Conservatives write Hate Articles. Innovative in a hypocritical frothing kind of way. Admittedly you’re shooting at Coulter, who makes a good target because she writes sledgehammer style, and loves the attention, and lump her in with the more popular and softer Talk Radio hosts.
ReplyDeleteThanks to rightwingnuthouse.com for linking me here. And thank you for a funny article, complaining about the same tactic you are using. On the HTPLL scale, I give this 476 points, a new record! (georgfelis.blogspot.com)
From Georgfelis at 12:43PM:
ReplyDelete"Hm, a Hate Article, complaining how the Conservatives write Hate Articles."
Wonderful. They're multiplying (hopefully asexually).
You're right. I hate bigotry. The rest of civilized humanity does to. Please come join us.
ReplyDeletegeorgfelis:
ReplyDeleteLet's see, you create a new word (and capitalize it), Hate Article, then vaguely claim that the original post is "complaining about the same tactic you are using." What tactic would that be? Why don't you point it out?
It's too easy. These guys make fun of themselves.
Shooter:
ReplyDeleteDude. Honestly. If you're trying to build credibility about being funny, you should move beyond books with names like 1001 Jokes for Kids.
Coulter also isn't the humorist you'd make her out to be. That was PJ O'Rourke, whose name hasn't appeared in any discussion here, despite that fact that he's been mocking us, well, for roughly twice as long as the Coulters and Malkins.
The reason you can't tell the difference is that you're fundamentally un-American. Like most conservatives, your love of nation is most akin to a vulture's love of zebra. You'll happily send soldiers to die and bleed the nation's coffers, just as long as you can feed on its decaying flesh.
Funny, right? Not so much? Then stop trying to defend Coulter. Her style of "humor" is indefensible.
(And now watch as that paragraph appears in Malkin's next book.)
It's interesting to note that among many right-wing extremists, the word "liberal" is a conservative code word for "Jew" ....
ReplyDeleteDuring the 2004 election, Coulter didn't even bother to use the code. She was the one pushing the story about Kerry discovering his (partial) Jewish heritage.
I wonder why she thought it was important?
.
Brilliant post over at Right Wing Nut House. What a wonderful collection of childish insults displaying the mindset of a playground bully. Rick Moran has likely never read anything I've written before, likely knows nothing about my politcs, but begins by characterizing me as a cry baby "leftist" because I believe that our national media should promote responsible discourse and not give a platform to someone like COulter.
ReplyDeleteCivility, respect, and basic human decency are apparently weaknesses to be mocked.
Next, Moran calls me a liar, and anyone who believes that I had a friend who began reading a Coulter book to learn about politics is "an idiot liberal."
"Intellectually bankrupt? Hardly. Coulter may be many things but even her enemies concede she has a first class mind."
This is Moran speaking of the person who just devoted 1/3 of her new book to "proving" evolution isn't science.
Read the Spinsanity article and you've already seen the approach of Moran parsed, as his is the same as Coulter's. Sweeping generalizations, emotional code words, distorations of what I've said, etc.
For example, he says I've called conservatives fascists because I linked to Dave Neiwert's article (which Mr. Moran purports to have debunked - Neiwert's response is here) even though the article explicity says that conservatives ARE NOT fascists.
Modern conservatism is a disease like Ebola that makes truth leave the body like blood through one's pores. Given the terrifying intellectual mortality of this disease, its carriers and incubators should be forcibly removed from polite society and eliminated for the threat they represent to civil society.
ReplyDeleteHaha, that's just a joke. Can't you wingnuts take one?
Where does one begin to deconstruct this bilge? Why would we want to substitute the word “liberal” for the word “Jew” or “black” or any other racial or religious group ? How can anyone be so incredibly arrogant and self-righteous to think that mocking someone for their political beliefs are in any way, shape, or form similar to making fun of one’s race?
ReplyDeleteBecause like the bigots who "make fun" of one's race, they are making fun of stereotypes. Because, as Moran himseld demonstrates in his response, they do not address the actual beliefs presented to them, but instead some hypothetical straw-man "liberal" - an entity that exists in Moran's own mind.
Notice he no where in his article can offer a defense of Coulter's eliminationism, other than to try to turn the issue into a character attack on me. Like Coulter, Moran substitutes insult for substance, and anyone who calls him on it is a "liberal."
I'm constantly tempted by the "they're shameless and/or insane; it's best to just ignore them" thought too, but alas, you're right: these people's influence only seems to grow when you ignore them. Case in point: last semester I was reading a paper from a fairly bright student. He included a quotation that basically warned about the dangers of science (especially evolutionary science) by pointing out that, hey, THE NAZIS were really interested in science. The quotation was rather hyperbolic and made little sense in the context of the paper; I was curious, so I checked out the reference. It was from a book by Michael Savage! Of all the books out there in the world, some of them really good, and some of those even written by real conservatives -- why on Earth would someone waste their time reading Michael Savage? Alas, H's G is right: lots of people out there are curious but don't know that much about the world of books -- making it easy to confuse celebrity and notoriety with competence and scholarship. One small part of the battle is to help them see when they've been had -- both by pundits cashing in by appealing to cheap prejudices and by publishers interested in maximizing profits and spreading propaganda. To wean such people away from hacks like Coulter and Malkin and Savage is not only a victory in contemporary political terms but a victory for the Western intellectual tradition stretching all the way back to Socrates.
ReplyDelete(By the way, the student in question wound up earning an A in the class. The rest of the paper was pretty good, too; I'm still puzzled as to why he even included Savage in it....)
--nashtbrutusandshort
Categorical Aperitif
That's one helluva tirade there, Mr. Ghost. Rarely have I seen so much projection in such a brainless article.
ReplyDeleteYou do have one thing confused though. Ann doesn't "hate" liberals as much as she is disgusted by them. It's the liberals who are moved to hate because people like Ann point them out for who they are and the vile things they say and do. I haven't heard or read you refute anything Coulter has written - although I have read repeatedly how much it makes YOU HATE her.
Yep, pure case of projection. And hate. You'd better get that puppy to the vet 'cuz it sure is sick.
Ok, ok, THIS is some creepy shit. coulterfan is accusing others of projection while projecting his own hatred on others. What the hell is with that? Seriously.
ReplyDeleteThink about it. coulterfan says that Coulter knows what "liberals" think (I honestly don't know what is considered a liberal these days). How? Where does she get this insight? From her own imagination? So doesn't that mean SHE is the one thinking and doing vile things? coulterfan says Coulter and people like her "point them out for who they are and the vile things they say and do." Who they are? Huh?
Come on now, coulterfan. You say liberals are "moved to hate". With what, Coulter's love and understanding? Her clever death threats? Somehow she is not using hate to make others feel disgust at her words? Explain that.
coulterfan's very statement is the definition of projection. It's hard for me to understand how someone comes to believe that! Really.
"I haven't heard or read you refute anything Coulter has written"
ReplyDeleteLet's take one at random. The link to Pharyngula. You don't think that refutes the claim that there is no evidence supporting evolution? Maybe you should spend some time at the Evolution/Creation forum and them come back and tell me that.
From anonymous at 4:22PM:
ReplyDelete"When liberals, the parasitic scum of the planet our outted by the likes of Ms. Malkin, Ms. Coulter, Rush, and others for being the abysmally ignorant but seditious swine they are, why not whine?"
Is this meant to be irony, satire, parody, or some silly combination of all three?
Thank you for laying out why ignoring is not an option! I was shocked to see not one but four letters defending Coulter in the Saturday edition of my local paper, the Charlotte Observer. In large part because of reading Glenn's book and this and other progressive blogs, I was moved to respond by writing a letter of my own, condemning her "deliberately cruel" rhetoric and questioning how it came to be considered acceptable as political commentary. My letter was published yesterday, and I take some satisfaction that those were two column inches that didn't go to someone praising Bush's leadership and vision (another popular theme). A very small step, I know, but we have got to start pushing back!
ReplyDeleteInterestingly, Larry King interviewed a man whose wife had died on 9/11 regarding Coulter, and he said he'd never heard of her until the whole hullabaloo around her disparagement of the Jersey Girls.
ReplyDeleteWhile Coulter gaining notoriety sounds like a negative, it's, in fact, a positive, because they guy thought she was ridiculous. So, her little "any publicity is good publicity" may have backfired in some circles. Just think, had you never heard of her before, would you find her comments intelligent, insightful or meaningful? Not likely, unless you're as big a hatemonger as she is. In that case, you probably would have heard about her already.
-Kristin
Please confront the "Republican noise machine" all you want, but I would posit that you already have quite the noise machine already in place on the Left. Kos, Dean, Murtha, Sheehan, et al are more noise than we need, thank you very much. Amping it up is only going to sound like the hip hop car next to you on the street, blaring the bass so loud that you want to scream "shut up". How loud do you really need to be, folks?
ReplyDeleteWhy the high dudgeon over Coulter anyhow? She's an act. A schtick. We also have something called the First Amendment, which seems fine for you as long as you agree with the speech. If you don't agree with the speech, the speech is "hateful", "sexist", "racist", "homophobic", "fascist", or similar label. American's have been listening, and tolerating, this propaganda from your side for at least four decades now, and it's worn out its usefulness. It's transparently the dogma of your secular religion, and won't be tolerated any longer. You can't hide your intentions by calling out political sideshows like Ann Coulter. People are smarter than that, and you'll have to get smarter if you're going to succeed again in the political sphere.
From brian at 6:51PM:
ReplyDelete"It's transparently the dogma of your secular religion, and won't be tolerated any longer."
How amusing. Is that a threat, or a promise?
Are we all to be cruxified?
Seriously, Brian. You wish to tolerate Coulter and company as your spokespeople (complete with not-so-veiled threats of violence and murder if we dare advocate our beliefs), that's your right. But don't expect you won't be tarred right alongside them.
Like it or not, their right to say whatever they like *doesn't* empty it of its content, which is racists, bigoted, and dangerous.
Hope you can live in that sewer with them.
We also have something called the First Amendment, which seems fine for you as long as you agree with the speech. If you don't agree with the speech, the speech is "hateful", "sexist", "racist", "homophobic", "fascist", or similar label.
ReplyDeleteI called her speech hateful. This means that you believe that telling widows that if their husbands would have lived they would have divorced them is not hateful. Is that what you believe? Is that what you are hear to defend?
Not too long ago a friend of mine told me she was trying to become more politically informed. To do so, she continued, she had begun reading Ann Coulter's How to Talk to a Liberal (If You Must).
ReplyDeleteHonestly, that's like someone wanting to learn about Islam by reading Alec Rawls.
Is that what you believe? Is that what you are hear to defend?
ReplyDeleteI guess hateful isn't hateful if a lib says it's hateful.
Brian doesn't even bother with realizing that calling Ann's comments hateful is nothing more than calling a spade a spade. Rather, he wants to place the burden back on the "libs." That way, she has to take no responsibility for her crude comments, and instead turns herself into the victim of "over-sensitive libs."
It might be ingenius if it weren't so utterly transparent.
Some of the conservative responses to HG's post are instructive.
ReplyDeleteFor instance they don't consider the analogies to Racial or anti-Semitic hate speech valid, because in fact Coulter is not directing her hate to Black people or Jews. In other words, conservatives don't believe that hateful speech in of itself is wrong if it is in fact directed at targets that are deserving of the speech. You see this in their general revulsion to PC -- in that (to use HG's words) it is OK to call a spade a spade.
They consider it a liberal "bleeding-heart" flaw to be afraid to criticize something that merits criticism.
Therefore, when Liberals complain about the type of speech that Coulter uses, or worse, compares it Racist speech, the Conservative mind set sees it as invoking PC. That is why you are seeing comments like "since when can Liberals not be made fun of (or criticized).
I understand that HG is simply pointing out similarities in how labels are applied to de-humanize a group and to render actual debate of their ideas as irrelevant. But the Conservatives (and I can see their perspective too) only see that Liberals are trying to hide behind a shield of PC. Even worse, many may believe (incorrectly) that they are now also being accused of being Racists when, of course, they are not being Racist/Anti-Semitic -- they are only being "Liberal-ists".
I think this is instructive, because it demonstrates that criticizing Coulter and her ilk for being "hateful" is not an effective tactic and, in fact, probably only serves to reinforce Conservative opinions about "cry baby" overly PC Liberals. (The letter example in HG's post is effectively criticizing Liberal PC-ness)
The only thing that we (people who find Coulter distasteful) should focus on is her lies. By de-bunking her caricature of what a Liberal is, you effectively pull the rug out from under her "jokes".
Consider the letter again. This letter works only because Conservatives assume the detainee in question is actually a Terrorist. If we assume that the detainee is one of the many innocent people rounded up (the true concern of the Liberal character in the letter), then the whole letter does not work as satire.
Same with Coulter. Simply (well, not so simply, but somehow) demonstrate that most of her assertions are false and the rest will take care of itself.
Don't let the Coulters of the world define the word "Liberal". Somehow the liberals must re-define who and what they are and what they really stand for.
Unfortunately, the media works to our disadvantage here. The people getting the most press -- Cindy Sheehan comes to mind -- simply reinforce the Right's view of the Left. And it cuts both ways. I will wager that most Conservatives and Republicans are not reflected by the Malkins and Coulters. We should remember that as well, lest Liberals and Independents start believing that all Conservatives are evil wing nuts.
I too think these "pundits" are hateful and ignorant. Though I think I am more APPALLED when NO ONE stands up to them when they spout hateful remarks or try to validate their statements. In this weeks column by Susan Estrich she rushed to defend Ann Coulter and her remark about 9/11 widows. I am shocked, I thought she was a liberal! Perhaps there are none left in the media but Molly Ivins and Jon Stewart.
ReplyDeleteI agree that we need to address the Ann Coulters and Michelle Malkins of the world. Especially calling them out when they try to push out the line of what is acceptable - for example, that the widows of 9/11 are enjoying their widowhood and were happy their husbands were killed and they have no right to speak out about it.
ReplyDeleteOne non-intuitive and admittedly indirect way to deal with them and their ilk is to publicly espouse some of the progressive things that (in my opinion) most Liberals believe in that are going to happen in this country. These are all "when" not "if" things - maybe not today or tomorrow, but soon enough.
- Gay people will have marriage or something resembling it (like civil union)
- Evolution is proven science and intelligent design and other creationist approaches will not replace it in our schools
- Birth control is only going to get more inexpensive, effective and available. Someday, the majority of unwanted pregnancies will happen to the women and girls of the abstinence-only crowd.
- Universal health care is going to happen in the US. As the cost of health care to business and to the nation continues to rise, it will be less expensive and more compassionate to offer it than what we have now.
- The US won't have the resources or the will for another "war of choice" for many, many years. We'll be able to defend ourselves, but Iraq-style adventures will be virtually impossible.
- Global warming is happening and is caused by human activity
These are the ones I came up with off the top of my head, but I'm sure there are more. They are progressive ideas guaranteed to set off the wingers. They are also things that I strongly believe will happen in the coming years. It won't hurt if larger numbers of people start also believing that it is inevitable.
Does it mean we don't have to do anything for them to happen? Of course not. But the tide is still in the progressive direction and the science is only getting more solid as time goes on. Making a winger fight these ideas will drive them nuts and also makes them fight against the tide - they will wear themselves out worrying about and trying to oppose these ideas. Think about it - in the next 5-20 years, how likely is it that the things in my list will occur? I would say near 100% on all of them.
This is a way you can attack the conservative mindset and make them worry about progressives and progressive ideas. Ann Coulter is only funny to conservatives when her audience thinks they are a majority and that it is safe to be hateful.
-Geekmouth
But the key question remains; how do you get through to the ignorant people who only hear this hate rhetoric and therefore have nothing in their lives to counter it?
ReplyDeleteIf the only people who hear your eloquent words are intelligent and already aware, what is accomplished?
I mean no disrespect. I really would like to hear some kind of answer to this conundrum.
But the key question remains; how do you get through to the ignorant people who only hear this hate rhetoric and therefore have nothing in their lives to counter it?
ReplyDeleteWork from the bottom up. Be able to explain to friends, family, aquaintances, etc what is wrong with Coulter's speech and where her reasoning is deficient. If your paper syndicates her column write a letter to the editor answering it.
Work to make small changes in the world around you and if enough people do it then their efforts begin to aggregate. I think people get discouraged by looking at a large problem thinking they need to make superhuman contributions to make a difference.
As Phil Jackson was fond of quoting:
"A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step."