The blogger Misha of the blog Anti-Idiotarian Rottweiler is one of the most linked-to and popular bloggers in the right-wing blogosphere. He's the 42nd most linked-to blogger on the Internet, and he is in the blogroll of scores of right-wing bloggers, such as Michelle Malkin and Captian's Quarters Blog. He wrote a post today discussing the Supreme Court's decision in Hamdan and here is what he said:
Of course, this is the same Supreme Court that earlier decided in Kelo that private property rights only matter as long as a private company doesn’t offer a better deal, above or below the table, to local authorities, so one shouldn’t really be surprised. The unelected, black-robed tyrants have a long history of not giving a fig about the Constitution if they don’t like what it says, not to mention a long tradition of usurping the powers of the legislative and executive branch by ruling by judicial fiat. . . .
Try doing anything to those mutilating darlings of the Supremes in order to extract life-saving intel from them, and then wait for the Supreme Whores to decide that you were “humiliating” them in doing so.
Five ropes, five robes, five trees.
Some assembly required.
He's advocating that the five Supreme Court Justices in the Hamdan majority be hanged from the neck until they're dead. His homicidal formulation is a play on the more standard call of the Right for American journalists to be hanged -- "Journalists. Rope. Tree. Some assembly required" -- another death call which, it just so happens, Misha also issued just a few days ago.
Misha's deranged pleas that journalists and Supreme Court Justices be murdered extends to his comment section, where one finds things such as this:
I said shortly after 9/11, NCLivingBrit, that the only way we would win this war was to turn the entirety of the islamic territories into a radioactive glass parking lot. I’d just as soon not see us do that, however. I just can’t sanguinely write off a few billion people that way, even if the world would be a better place afterwards. But unless the traitors within are eliminated, they will eventually bring us down.
And this:
Why has Bush been such a mighty disappointment (at least to me) in regards to this sort of action by the terrorist towel heads? . . . I think we could help the terrorist towel heads shed a few excess pounds via head removal system instead of Jenny Craig…
And this:
Winning the hearts and minds of muslims to democracy and capitalism is like separating the stink from shit. Good luck with that.
But what's so very confounding is that of all the countless right-wing bloggers who spent the weekend so very horrified about the comments of that influential political leader of liberalism, Deb Frisch, or who lamented that she wasn't condemned aggressively enough for her idiotic comments to Jeff Goldstein, none of them has condemned these calls by their fellow prominent right-wing blogger for American journalists and Supreme Court justices to be hung by trees until their neck snaps (indeed, one of the right-wing bloggers joining in the weekend sermons against this mean Deb Frisch rhetoric was that Beacon of Right-wing propriety, Misha himself).
What happened? They all seemed to find such disturbing rhetoric so upsetting, such cause for great alarm this weekend, when it came from an obscure person in some comment section, but they have not said a word of condemnation about these death calls from a prominent blogger on the Right. Nor have any of them condemned the calls by Misha's readers for Islamic countries to be turned into radioactive parking lots or for the death of the towel heads by other means. Why not?
Nor did they condemn another prominent right-wing blogger, Dean Esmay, when he presciently called for the hanging of NYT reporters way back in December, long before the johnny-came-lately noose advocates like Misha did so. Nor did they condemn right-wing radio host (and guest host for Sean Hannity) Michael Reagan's call for Howard Dean to be hanged. Nor, for that matter, have any of them condemned the calls by David Horowitz for the names, home addresses and security systems of NYT editors and reporters to be published on the Internet, nor have any of them condemned publication by right-wing blogger Dan Riehl of the satellite photographs of the home of the NYT Publisher (unsurprisingly, Riehl himself, along with Misha, was among the right-wing bloggers sermonizing this weekend about the terrible comments made to Goldstein). Nor have they condemned comments from the Grand Victim himself, Jeff Goldstein, that are reprehensible and revolting by any measure.
Let us stipulate that there are crazed, insane lunatics and repugnant individuals on both the Right and the Left. Any honest person would readily acknowledge that.
But while right-wing bloggers have to dig under rocks to find obscure commenters making reprehensible comments, many of the most prominent bloggers and opinion leaders on the Right routinely and blithely call for people's deaths, and some even post their home addresses on the Internet for anyone who wants help making those recommendations turn into a reality. The most popular right-wing authors sell millions of books by attacking their political opponents as treasonous and mentally ill.
Nobody needs to wade through the depths of comment sections to find this rhetoric on the Right, nor does anyone need to seize on totally obscure individuals and -- a la Ward Churchill or Deb Frisch -- absurdly try to transform them into some sort of political leader in order to impose responsibility for their moronic statements on people who never even heard of them before. One need only peruse the routine hate-mongering of the Right's opinion leaders and their prominent bloggers -- the Malkins and the Mishas and the David Horowitzs and the Ann Coulters -- and one will find more hateful and deranged rhetoric than one can stomach. And it is almost never condemned, including by those who self-righteously parade themselves around as Defenders of Civility and have the audacity to demand that others condemn such rhetoric when it comes from far less significant and influential corners.
Based on the grieving rituals we had to endure this weekend over Jeff Goldstein's sensibilities, I presume it's fair to infer that the silence from right-wing bloggers over Misha's calls for the deaths of journalists and Supreme Court Justices means -- as one of the most-cited sermons put it -- that "one might be tempted to think that this absolute lack of condemnation was a tacit acceptance of these tactics." One might be particularly tempted to think that given that such rhetoric flows not merely from obscure commenters on right-wing blogs, but also from the Right's leading bloggers and pundits, with virtually no condemnation of any kind.
Glenn,
ReplyDeleteIt's actually Deb Frisch. You have "Fisch".
Glenn, that's your problem, you think logical and ethical consistency are qualities that should be shared and lauded, and as we all know, with the GOP Media Whores & Lackey's like those you pointed out with this post, logical and ethical consistency are qualities to be avoided at all costs
ReplyDeleteWhy a king? And why a king now?
ReplyDeleteRob
Personally I reject the tribalism that requires me as a left leaning blogger to apologize for the over-the-top rants of lone cranks, and I don't feel that those on the right should be required to do so either. But then, we on the left aren't the ones making that sort of demand. It's the folks on the right who consistently demand that we all be our brothers and sisters ideological watchdogs. So in that sense, it would be nice to see them practice what they preach, at least ocassionally...
ReplyDeleteBut we NEED a vast glass parking lot!
ReplyDeleteWhere else will the Walmart shoppers park?
Jen said...
ReplyDeletecheck out my jewelry blog!
Jen's jewelry blog is called "Midnight Beadings". I think it might be Misha in drag. It's actually "Midnight Beatings" and all the "necklaces" are made out of hemp.
Of course, then there was Mike Ledeen who looked at the assassination of a high court judge in Turkey recently and warned that it was a matter of time before the "deranged elite" of this country would make it possible for a true believer to charge into an American courtroom, pull out a gun, and shout "god is great" before pulling the trigger.
ReplyDeleteI still wonder which deranged elite he was talking about.
Four things:
ReplyDelete1) I have never heard of Deb Frisch in my life (until today, that is), and I am a self-described liberal.
2) I read some comments directed toward her from what I presume are right wingers, and the one overarching comment? They've all diagnosed her as mentally ill. Is that the "Frist Diagnosis" method?
3) Do the aforementioned diagnoses mean that Misha is mentally ill, as well? Or do they think he's just really witty? It's really amusing how hysterically angry, sanctimonious and indignant the right wingers are about Ms. Fisch's comments (however disgusting they were), while ignoring the pursuits of their own heroes (Misha, Ann, Michelle, etc). As with most things in the "moral values," "compassionate conservative" community, it's the hypocrisy, stupid.
4) What's even funnier than the hypocrisy is that someone said that Jeff Goldstein is "insightful and intelligent."
This is bad enough, but couple your report with this headline from Raw Story:
ReplyDelete50 year study says conservatives 'followers'
In an interview with MSNBC's Keith Olbermann, former Nixon counsel John Dean explained a largely unknown 50 year academic study. The data shows that conservatives are much more likely to follow authoritarian leaders.
http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Video_50_year_study_says_conservatives_0711.html
Your regular trolls can spin this any way they want to - for most of America, the neocons and repugs are just scary. I pray that we can:
1. Shift the discussion to FREE, FAIR, OPEN, VERIFIABLE ELECTIONS
2. Introduce more tolerance of diverse views across some of the so-called "liberal" blogosphere.
Without a "big tent" and honest elections, it is clear what will happen to the "American Experiment."
logical and ethical consistency mean nothing to the neocons, conservatives, and kool-aiders. They actually represent a minority now, thank God, but we will need to get people out to the polls and then be sure their votes are counted.
ReplyDeleteIMHO, it is a shame to see all this blogging about platitudes and so little about the greatest crimes of this administration which include the theft of 2 federal elections and complicity with the worst civilian attack on US soil.
From anonymous at 6:42 p.m.: "The data shows that conservatives are much more likely to follow authoritarian leaders."
ReplyDeleteMaybe that's why . . . .
Rob
The Good Rev. Mykeru tangoed with one of the Rottweiler gang last year. It was hilarious to watch.
ReplyDeleteRest assured that these fanatics threaten as naturally as they breathe; they'll never follow through. This is most likely because they've weighed the possible outcomes and understand things would not wind up in their favor.
Deb Frisch has posted about this on a listserv of which I am a member. Among other things, she says she didn't write some of the things she is accused of saying. Specifically,
ReplyDelete"I have admitted to writing 90% of the horrible things attributed to me. It would have been easy to deny writing it all the next day and say someone typed in my email address and website (that's all it takes to write comments on his blog.) But I didn't want to lie.
There is one passage that I deny writing. Jeff is obsessed with dickering over this passage. Even though I backed down and apologized"
She was writing to solicit help dealing with Fox News, which was threatening her if she did not appear to discuss this on John Gibson's show. Most of the responses on the list were to the effect that neither the original "discussion" (god is a woman) or the subsequent responses have anything to do with liberals. Not only is she way out, she isn't really political as much as religious.
Glenn, please, this is just absurd...I wasn't even aware of the comment until I just read it here. Is every blogger on the right responsible for every comment made by every other blogger on the right? Do I condemn you because Kos said 'Screw them' to the sight of dead Americans being paraded around the streets of Iraq merely because they worked as contractors?
ReplyDeleteThis is a complete waste of time. Why not address the Pentagon memo today regarding Gitmo and Geneva, as it appears at first glance to directly contradict your premise of an imperial presidency and is certainly more germane than what one idiot says on his blog...
I'd really like to think they wouldn't follow through. And indeed, that's probably correct.
ReplyDeleteIt's their readers I'm concerned about.
Glenn... Glenn, why are you being utterly reality-based and disclosing the facts of the stinky hypocrisy of Righties whom consistently advocating the Hitler-style genocide of liberals, Lefties, children, Supreme Court Justices, feminists, pro-Civil Right, pro-Constitution, Pro-America, pro-Jesus' teaching (look up Matthew 22:36-40, Matthew 19:24, Matthew 5:44 and Matthew 5:9 in the Bible*), pro-Democracy, pro-Equality, et al?
ReplyDeleteYou're a bad, bad, bad boy for rubbing the ugly facts in Righties' faces. They don't like it when non-Rightie point out their unstoppable hypocrisy in public. It's a sin! Conservative's Twelve Commandment said so, allow me quote their twelfth Commandment:
"Non-Rightie shall not reveal our Hypocrisy to thy neighbor. For them, it's a evil deed and it's a deadly sin to do so."
See? I plead to you, stop revealing their Hypocrisy. I don't want to see you going to the hell. [insert the sad face]. By the way, great entry as usual.
*For people who are too lazy to look it up or didn't study the Bible:
Matthew 22:36-40: "Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?" Jesus replied: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments."
Matthew 19:24: "Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
Matthew 5:44: "But I tell you: Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you"
Matthew 5:9: "Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God."
A test...
ReplyDeletePlease select who will be on the ballot in less than 4 months to run America:
1. George Bush
2. Ann Coulter
3. Right-wing bloggers
4. Republican Congressmen
Please select who center and left bloggers and press have wasted time attacking in the the run-up to the election, which is less than 4 months away:
1. George Bush
2. Ann Coulter
3. Right-wing bloggers
4. Republican Congressmen
Did you pass?
So, the right only notices when we talk like they do?
ReplyDeleteI'll have to remember that one, just in case I reeeeeaaallllyyy need them to actually listen for a change.
What a strange quirk of reading comprehension.
.
Glenn,
ReplyDeleteI certainly applaud your efforts to call out these extremists who pass themselves off as center-right bloggers and in Hinderaker, Coulter, Malkin and Hewitt's case, have obtained the status of national media figures. I only hope that America will wake up one day and see these people for the hate mongerers that they are.
I have a different expectation for Misha's site, and it's hard for me to put him in the same category as these more prominent figures. Misha will never be on Fox News or MSNBC. He's too far out there.
Put it this way. With a name like "Emperor Darth Misha" you tend to expect something more like performance art than op-ed. It's theater. Mindless, violent, degrading theater.
Please select who center and left bloggers and press have wasted time attacking in the the run-up to the election, which is less than 4 months away:
ReplyDeleteWhy do you think the Right spends so much time talking about Michael Moore and ridiculing Barbara Streisand or focusing on Deb Frisch? One of the ways -- one of the most effective ways -- to highlight the flaws of a political movement is to demonize their representatives and try to attribute the characteristics of the extremists to the movement itself. Another tactic is to discredit the spokespeople and pundits for that movement.
You may think that the best strategy is to sit around and talk about Denny Hastert's voting record and whether John Warner is a good Chairman of the Armed Services Committee - since, as you reason, "hey, they're the ones on the ballot, so we should only talk about them" - but that strikes me as an extremely simplistic and unproductive way to convey the real poltical struggles going on in our country.
The biggest favor you could do for Republicans is to ignore the Ann Coulters and James Dobsons and the hate-mongering pundits which comprise the backbone of their party.
Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteIMHO, it is a shame to see all this blogging about platitudes and so little about the greatest crimes of this administration which include the theft of 2 federal elections and complicity with the worst civilian attack on US soil.
There is no legal mechanism to reverse a "stolen" election, if that's what it was. I think there were problems and that the elections were less than "fair".
Elections are like trials. The SCOTUS has said we may reasonably expect that trials should be fair. No one expects them to be perfect, nor are they required to be.
As far as the other issue, we all have questions, and very few answers, but questions are not evidence of anything but doubt.
Anonymous said...
Deb Frisch has posted about this on a listserv of which I am a member. Among other things, she says she didn't write some of the things she is accused of saying. Specifically...
Goldstain has been known to not only delete comments and even edit comments, he has altered them. It is most likely he altered some of her comments. She is still a bit odd, but that's no crime.
Oh, this is just like when they go all approvingly goo-goo eyed over Ann Coulter's or Michelle Malkin's or Glenn Beck's latest eliminationist screeds and then go and pretend that some guy named Ward Churchill is The God Of The Left. (Even though a) the guy was and still is an obscure college prof who nobody had heard of before, and b) the guy said repeatedly -- and with much justification -- that he was a conservative or a libertarian, but NEVER a liberal.)
ReplyDeleteGlenn... The biggest favor you could do for Republicans is to ignore the Ann Coulters and James Dobsons and the hate-mongering pundits which comprise the backbone of their party.
ReplyDeleteWhen the Coulters and Dobsons are not even getting invited to the Grand Openings of the New Taco Bells, then you can safely ignore them. You cannot safely ignore people the MSM caters to.
Absolutely spot - on GG. There was an op-ed that ran in some papers over the weekend from a self-proclaimed conservative saying, essentially, "Ann Coulter doesn't speak for me nor does she speak for any of my Republican friends." He gets it and has to run fast and far from her. People need to be reminded that if Denny Hastert and Bill Frist remain in charge, people like Ann, Rush, etc. will remain the driving ideological force of our government. It is a campaign against them as much as it is a campaign against the elected Republican leadership. Voters have to know that.
ReplyDeleteDesert Son said...
ReplyDeleteWhy a king? And why a king now?
Rob
I keep asking, 'why a duck.'
And you better not piss off Lord Spatula! He might pee on himself. In rage, of course, not fear.
The biggest favor you could do for Republicans is to ignore the Ann Coulters and James Dobsons and the hate-mongering pundits which comprise the backbone of their party.
ReplyDeleteEXACTLY!
The thing is that, unlike the Republicans, we don't have to invent or fake the existence of unsavory, amoral prominent Republican dickweeds. All we have to do is to point out, over and over again, that these people ARE the Republican Party. Not a "fringe". Certainly not considered "disreputable" by most fervent Republicans. Nope, THEY ARE THE PARTY.
Remember when Smerconish a few weeks ago tried to distance himself (and other "nice" Republicans) from Ann Coulter, by claiming that she wasn't part of the GOP mainstream? He immediately got flamed, long and hard, by hardcore Republican Ann fans whose comments abundantly proved him wrong.
A colorful and compelling case that Goldstain alters comments
ReplyDeleteAnd reason to suspect that he altered Frisch's comments to some degree, but she gave him the opportunity. Althouse, Goldstein, all of them who allow comments, will delete them if you make them look like the idiots they are. Always keep a copy of your comments when commenting on RW blogs. Even if, especially if, you are famous.
But Atrios calls people wankers and that proves the "left" is just as bad:)
ReplyDeleteMisha called for a lynching the day of the decision. This post is just an elaboration on that sentiment.
ReplyDeleteHe is truly scum.
But Atrios calls people wankers and that proves the "left" is just as bad:)
ReplyDeleteI hear some of them even use curse words - in e-mails and posts and everything.
Calling for people's deaths and posting their home addresses on the internet might be bad, but using bad words is the sign of true derangement and shows how crazed and fevered "the Left" is.
Way to go, Glenn. Someone's got to keep the heel on their throats. Appreciated
ReplyDeleteWhile I am certainly sympathetic to your argument, is there any point to joining the who-didn't-condemn-who circle jerk? Of course, it is atrocious that people like Glenn Reynolds still link to Misha and Charles Johnson. And I know, the hypocrisy of the right on this stuff is infuriating. But hypocrisy doesn’t bother them and most other people don’t care. Someone as bright as you, Glenn, can probably find more valuable uses of your time than surfing through the sociopathic ranting of the “Anti-Idiotarian Rottweiler.”
ReplyDeleteYou say it well, but people have been pointing out this sort of thing for years.
Tom Hilton said...
ReplyDeleteMisha called for a lynching the day of the decision. This post is just an elaboration on that sentiment.
He is truly scum.
Actually, if you leave politics and religion out of it, Misha's not a bad guy, or so I hear and I know someone who has met him a few times and deals with him often. He
no longer comments there, being the only progressive they didn't completely savage. He also used to believe you can reason with them. He has since been disabused of this notion. I used to comment there, but was threatened with banning because I made them look stupid. I never felt reason was a useful tool, shame and humiliation from ridicule being much more effective. I was usually half asleep at the time. How hard can it be? Some of his ex-fans have come to their senses. It's not unheard of. They have even credited us, but I think they deserve all the credit for this transformation themselves. Misha does some scummy things. Primarliy he is a purveyor of bloody red meat for his minions.
There is no legal mechanism to reverse a "stolen" election, if that's what it was. I think there were problems and that the elections were less than "fair".
ReplyDeleteTrue and Al Gore has said that much - after the SCOTUS appointed the chimperor, there was nothing else he could do.
But we can keep talking about it and building concensus that those (left and right) that support democracy mostly support fair, free, open, and verifiable elections.
My concern is that these topics are "off-the-table" on many boards (including one that glenn guest posts at). That does not help matters, it is a legitimate issue and all the stuff about "consitency and integrity blah blah blah" means nothing without verifiable electins.
Just saying that we can build concensus for change by talking about some basic simple issues and having some respect when those that want to see change have differences on other issues.
There is the more refined version of what Misha is up to. For instance, what exactly does Charles Krauthammer mean by this?
ReplyDeleteThe [Supreme] court has decreed: There is no war -- or we will pretend so -- and henceforth it shall be conducted by the court. God save the United States. (This honorable court can fend for itself.)
But Atrios calls people wankers and that proves the "left" is just as bad:)
ReplyDeleteatrios may be a "cornerstone" of the faux "advertise liberally" circle of links, but there is not really much "left" about his snarky comments.
Sure, he regularly shows contempt for the administration and repugs.
He will not tolerate any discussion of traditional liberal/progressive issues, vote fraud, or the criminality that allowed the chimperor to declare that "everything changed after 911.
atrios may be a "superblog," but he certainly does not speak for the left. Just more of the ALL BLOG, NO ACTION crowd.
An ironic mirror of the 101st keyboarders that he is so quick to put-down.
I hear some of them even use curse words - in e-mails and posts and everything.
ReplyDeleteCurse words! Now that is truly over the line! I hearby call for the death of anybody who fucking swears!
Wait a min...uh oh
You can fight these wingnuts directly all you want, they'll just continue doing business as usual.
ReplyDeleteThe problem is: most people see them as wingnuts, in a world of their own, far away from anything they themselves will ever be faced with.
I wonder what Republicans have spoken approvingly of these guys, endorsed their words - less dispicable ones - in the past?
These are the people that need to be put on the spot. It's one thing when some fringe blogger writes something bad. It's another if your representative endorses one.
Because then they're not just living in their own crazy world any more: your Republican representative lives in there, too. He's just as crazy!
Do you really want someone who endorses those kinds of ideas to be your representative???
No wonder I refer to them as the Hate-R-Us crowd.
ReplyDeleteBut if you consider that the one issue that seems to divide the left vs right blogosphere (but not necessarily the country as a whole) is how acceptable is it to kill strangers? It's quite unsurprising that those who advocate killing strangers would enforce loyalty to the idea by advocating killing fellow countrymen who might otherwise object to killing strangers.
In case anyone is interested (and I know it doesn't really matter), Deb Frisch is a real person who has tried to explain herself here.
ReplyDeleteAnd no, I never heard of her before either.
I'd note Ed from Captain's Quarters chastized bloggers for trying to turn the Frisch thing into something partisan, explicitly that no one other than her should be accountable for her actions.
ReplyDeleteMichael Falcon-Gates said...
ReplyDeleteI still don't even know what the woman said.
She said some things that were bizarre and grotesgue, but quite normal for the level of commentary at Goldstain's blog. He posts veiled threats of violence and bizarre psycho-sexual stuff all the time. It's his oeuvre
I would reprint what I have read but since there is a question whether her comments were altered by Goldstain, I won't. There is a history here that involves some bloggers on the left who used to ridicule Goldstain. He responded by threatening them and their child and outing them. It's gotten uglier and uglier ever since. Even the stuff I read that may have been altered was not a credible or actionable threat, not even thinly veiled, just bizarre, gross, irresponsible and stupid. Attack Goldstein if you must, leave his wife and kid out of it. Even if he decided to drag the other folks kid into it first. Frisch just stumbled into this late and stepped in it.
Glenn: As always, right on the nail.
ReplyDeleteYou were brave even to bother to defend yourself over at Confederate Yankee's site the other day. He's not very open to reason or logic.
I don't know if you noticed, but five days before he condemned liberal bloggers for their silence on Frisch, somebody posted this right on the Confederate Yankee's own site:
We must systematically execute all liberals and democratnazis now, now, now. Let the purges begin. God help me I hate them so much. Kudos to you brother in arms for pointing out the truth!!!!!!! [Posted by Jehovah at July 3, 2006 05:09 PM]
Needless to say, this was made by some silly, anonymous troll, but what was remarkable was that the post was allowed to stand unremarked by both the host of the site and his commenters. It was still there long after he wrote the post on Frisch. (CY's site seems to be down, but you can confirm the existence of this quote using Google cache: "Confederate Yankee Jehovah")
I discuss this comment in specific and Yankee's post in general further in this post.
The Idiotarian Rotweiler seems to have forgotten that most of the Scotus members who were in the majority on Hamdan were approved by the rightwing Senators he admires so much.
ReplyDeleteJustices like Souter and Ginsberg were ratified by Orrin Hatch and the other GOP regressives in the Senate.
Oy.
Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteatrios may be a "cornerstone" of the faux "advertise liberally" Zzzzzz.....
Now here is an example of an assclown we can all safely ignore. At least until he gets booked on Good Morning America.
She was writing to solicit help dealing with Fox News, which was threatening her if she did not appear to discuss this on John Gibson's show
ReplyDeleteGood grief, really? Fox News thinks this is a story?
That has to be the most ridiculopus thing I've ever heard, some dustup in a blog somments section becoming nationally newsworthy. Even for Fox that's nuts.
Glenn, please, this is just absurd...I wasn't even aware of the comment until I just read it here. Is every blogger on the right responsible for every comment made by every other blogger on the right? Do I condemn you because Kos said 'Screw them' to the sight of dead Americans being paraded around the streets of Iraq merely because they worked as contractors?
ReplyDeleteThe point that Glenn is making is that part of weekemd Kabuki over this on the right blogosphere was implicitly or explicitly tying Frisch's behavior to "the left."
See, eg. Confedarate Yankee's post:
When conservative bloggers go over the line and publish personal information, they are condemned by their own. When a liberal blogger threaten child sex abuse and murder, what response do we get from prominent liberal blogs?
*crickets*
Not one post.
.....
One might be tempted to think this absolute lack of condemnation was a tacit acceptance of these tactics.
Goldsteins original post was on Frisch was titled "Another Example of the Tolerant Left" (rough paraphrase)
Given the right blogosphere's enthusiasm for imputing an unkown trolls words (I really, really would like a condemnation of Floyd Alvis Cooper, please) to the left, then similarly a well known and widely linked blogger* in the right blogospheres words should be imputed to them unless they properly condemn it.
(And if you've never heard of Mischa, then you haven't been in the blogosphere for very long. The Rott is what Little Green Footballs wishes it could be. All you need to know about him however, is contained in this google search
Gandalf...Do you really want someone who endorses those kinds of ideas to be your representative???
ReplyDeleteActually, Gandalf, about 25% of Americans would probably prefer Saruman, so don't tempt fate.
This is only a more explicit version of a threat Misha made on June 29:
ReplyDeleteThe Supreme Whores are in dire need of Intervention by Lynch Mob™.
I'm probably going to out myself as a super-nerdly type, but I seem to recall Mischa's blog getting quoted on "Wait Wait Don't Tell Me" earlier this year. I can't remember the context, but will try to look it up.
ReplyDeleteI visit Jeff's blog sometimes and venture a comment or two, which usually results a a swarm, which in turn is mildly funny. You've really got to have a thick skin and a high tolerance for graphoc language to read for any amount of time.
I was here a few days ago urging GG along for decrying some freaks' habits of posting personal info on hatey blogs, and subsequently defending to the point of flame-bait their 1st ammendment rights to do just that, short of credible threat of violence. But here, Glenn, I think you're a little behind the game. This story was thrashed on SN, etc., and I think there are better (worser) things with which to worry your beautiful mind. Don't get bunchy! I'm just eager for more GG-brand Bush Bashing legalese. You're so good at it.
ReplyDeletePeace!
For the record, as of right now, "Anti-Idiotarian Rottweiler" is indeed the #42 most-linked-to blog, according to Truth Laid Bear, and Deb Frisch's "south(west)paw" is #27,423.
ReplyDelete
ReplyDeleteI have never heard of Deb Frisch in my life (until today, that is), and I am a self-described liberal.
It is of course a pseudonym. The real name might be Jane Hamdan, or something similar.
In case casual readers missed it while checking out "Mischa's" site, this idiot actually sells a T-Shirt that says "Rope. Tree. Journalist. Some assembly required."
ReplyDeleteSo, you know, he's a funny dude. If you think killing people you disagree with is humorous.
Yet another wanna-be tough-guy 'winger who would probably have serious bladder-control issues if ever confronted in the flesh by one of the people he routinely threatens violence against.
Oh, and the post title is irony! dhu. Sarcasm... look it up. :)
ReplyDeleteWho is Deb Frisch? I've never heard of her. Ever.
ReplyDeleteToast said: In case casual readers missed it while checking out "Mischa's" site, this idiot actually sells a T-Shirt that says "Rope. Tree. Journalist. Some assembly required."
ReplyDeleteSo, you know, he's a funny dude. If you think killing people you disagree with is humorous.
What do you think the right wingers would do if someone took that t-shirt and changed the term "journalist" to "right wing pundit"? Congratulate him on his wit and creativity? Hardly.
The supreme irony here is, of course, that liberals aren't the ones claiming ad nauseum that they are the party of "moral values" and "compassion." They need to pick one - either they wear t-shirts with death threats OR they're into moral values. The two are pretty much mutually exclusive (unless you define moral values as hating everyone not white, rich and Republican).
9:10 PM
anonymous:
ReplyDeleteAlthouse, Goldstein, all of them who allow comments, will delete them if you make them look like the idiots they are. Always keep a copy of your comments when commenting on RW blogs. Even if, especially if, you are famous.
Yeah, I had one RW blog host both delete and alter my comments (as well as him and others forging my name on inane/puerile posts; he even followed me to Atrios and did his forging thing both to me and others there). Seems to be typical RW behaviour: dishonest and amoral. Starfleed Commander Ed simply banned me. Dean Esmay zapped me the first time I showed on his blog.
Cheers,
“while right-wing bloggers have to dig under rocks to find obscure commenters making reprehensible comments, many of the most prominent bloggers and opinion leaders on the Right routinely and blithely call for people's deaths”
ReplyDeleteThis is what happens when a pot boils down. All that is left behind is the scum.
I think the word is lynched, the preferred method of the KKK. To make matters worse.
ReplyDeleteHmmm... lets compare...
ReplyDeleteTalking about molesting, french kissing, and murdering a two year old child...
... with ...
Talking about executing traitors and black robed tyrants who have become essentially the new replacement for the British Monarchy...
The two year old has committed no crime. The judges have.
But Misha was definately far far worse, right?
If you believe that I question the existance of your brain.
Geez! Some clueless moonbat by the name of KingCranky II drooled on the following:
ReplyDelete"Glenn, that's your problem, you think logical and ethical consistency are qualities that should be shared and lauded, and as we all know, with the GOP Media Whores & Lackey's like those you pointed out with this post, logical and ethical consistency are qualities to be avoided at all costs"...:lol:
Hey Crank, you forgot to mention what planet it was that liberals supposedly think with, "logical and ethical consistency"...
Is it within 80 million lightyears of reality?
Face the fact Glen as a liberal you are little better than a totally useless parasite with seditous qualities that stem from the marrow of your bones...
Liberals hate facts as you have surely shown us...
Nice try but maybe in your next life you can come back with at least two working neurons in your cranial cavity...
I believe drunk posting should not be allowed. Perhaps this is the right wings problem?
ReplyDeleteGlenn,
ReplyDeleteI think you are wrong.
Nobody who believes the swill Ann Coulter & Co. put out is going to be swayed by logic.
I think the Democratic bloggers who play badminton with their opponents on the other side of the political net are doing so as an ego boost...it's cool to see your name in print.
But it's a losing strategy.
Remember how you felt when Kerry gave his concession speach back in 2004.
Then ask yourselves why you guys keep chasing every shiny ball Karl Rove rolls out into the traffic...
because it needs to be said
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exDo2SMdB-0&search=jesus%20off%20my%20penis
brave little anonymous said [in the midst of a big pile'o'crapola]:
ReplyDeleteFace the fact Glen as a liberal you are little better than a totally useless parasite with seditous qualities that stem from the marrow of your bones...
"I'm shot! ... Wounded! ... My life blood's draining away...."
WOw. you sure zinged Glenn there, so much that he's speechless and can't even respond to you.
The above reminds me of Jim Carrey in The Mask ... as he's dying in the arms of the gangster ... and then, next thing you hear: "Now, you got to ask yourself one question. 'Do I feel lucky?' Well do ya, punks?"
Better trolls, please.
Cheers,
Nobody who believes the swill Ann Coulter & Co. put out is going to be swayed by logic.
ReplyDeleteThe point isn't to sway people who follow Coulter. It's to sway people who don't follow Coulter that the Republican Party is actually the party of Coulter and therefore not a party they'd want to support.
Why is it so hard to get people to see the benefits of attaching the Coulters and Malkins and Michas to the GOP Party as its face. Aren't the benefits of doing that glaringly obvious?
Remember how you felt when Kerry gave his concession speach back in 2004.
Then ask yourselves why you guys keep chasing every shiny ball Karl Rove rolls out into the traffic...
Two points about this:
(1) People like you who come and say what a waste of time it is to focus on right-wing extremists always talk about Karl Rove like he's some sort of puppet master genius who is masterfully setting traps for people without their knowing.
But the GOP machine constantly expends efforts to blow up "left-wing extremists," make them radioactive, and attach them to the Democrats. Ward Churchill? Michael Moore? Harry Belafonte?
If you can't see the virtues and wisdom of doing that, shouldn't the fact that those tactics are used by Rove - whom you think is such a brilliant strategiest -- convince you that it's a smart thing to do?
(2) John Kerry lost the election, in large part, becuase he ignored the right-wing extremists who were demonizing him. "Oh, just ignore them. They're too crass and low to address. They'll just go away."
He ignored them, they didn't go away, and he lost. What an odd example for you to invoke in order to argue that right-wing extremists should be ignored.
Finally, for everyone who writes me e-mails or leaves comments telling me I'm wasting my time or energies or whatever talking about people such as this, please realize it's futile. I totally disagree and I'm going to continue to talk about them.
Executive power abuses and deceitful governments don't just pop up in the abstract. They have people behind them, who support them and are responsible for their power. I think it's extremely important to talk not only about the policies but about the people behind them.
Political movements are driven by personalities and individuals, not abstract concepts. Some people think we should "rise above it all" and just stand around talking abstractly in some rarified academic way purely about issues. But I'm not someone who thinks that way. The reason we have an extreme situation in our country is because we have extremists who are on power. I can't begin to understand the line of thought which counsels that those extremists should be ignored, as though they will simply go away if they are. That just isn't reality.
These bloggers and radio hosts like to pretend that either they didn't really say it, or they later qualified it, which then makes it all better. Does it?
ReplyDeleteWhen Melanie Morgan is on her radio show and says, "Hang 'em", with out qualifying it, are we suppose to ignore it and pretend it didn't happen?
http://s88172659.onlinehome.us/MelanieMorganHangem06272006H08M06.wma
Morgan on KSFO, Hang 'em!
Okay Ms. Morgan, where in that audio clip do you say tried and convicted? Nowhere. After she started getting some heat she tries to back petal and change her earlier comments because she KNOWS she shouldn't say that on commercially supported broadcast radio over the publicly owned airwaves.
REMEMBER, Morgan is NOT on satellite radio. She is on commercially supported broadcast radio. This isn't the Internet. There are and have been guidelines to speech on it for decades. For example, if you say the f-word you might get fined or reprimanded by the FCC. In addition, there are guidelines that are in place from Disney and KSFO. Some stations in the ABC family have fired their hosts for things that they have said. Case in point: Michael Graham at KMAL in D.C.
AND, here is an interesting kicker about her story: The WALL STREET JOURNAL is an advertiser on Morgan's show.
I wrote the WSJ advertising department on Friday (I cced Glenn and Humes Ghost so they can look for my letter if interested ) and asked them:
"Melanie Morgan called for the death of your editors. Why does the WSJ sponsor her radio program?"
I haven't heard from them.
But since she calls for the hanging death of people in the news media (withOUT calling for a trial and conviction) that doesn't mean the WSJ has to keep sponsoring her show.
And if you think is in only talking about the NY Times, she includes the WSJ in her comments:
"All of you people are equally guilty of treasonous behavior." [http://s88172659.onlinehome.us/Melanie_Morgan_All_guilty_of_treasonous_behavior06302006H05M06WSJ.wma]
Morgan on KSFO ""All of you people are equally guilty of treasonous behavior."
And finally, here is a truly tasteless clip from yesterday morning: [http://s88172659.onlinehome.us/MelanieMorganBrianSussmanOfficerVicKSFO07102006H08M06.wma
Morgan, Sussman and Vic joking about Keller in the Electric Chair] the first person you hear is Brian Sussman and the other guy is Officer Vic. Morgan's regular co-host, Lee Rogers, recently called for all the AP reporters to commit mass suicide [http://s88172659.onlinehome.us/Lee_Rogers_to_AP_Commit_Mass_Suicide_audio_from_KSFO_06292006H06M06.wma Morgan co-host calling for AP reporter to commit suicide]. At the end of the clip you hear Officer Vic making the sounds of Bill Keller in the Electric Chair.
It looks like blogger cut off the long URLs of the audio clips, luckily the same clips are in the hot links.
ReplyDeleteHere is another one.
Morgan, "I retract NOHING!" visit Spocko's Brain for more
Ryan said...
ReplyDelete"Rest assured that these fanatics threaten as naturally as they breathe; they'll never follow through. This is most likely because they've weighed the possible outcomes and understand things would not wind up in their favor."
They only follow through when they can fool someone elses kids into doing it for them.
I give you Viet Nam and Iraq. If you have noticed the threats against Iran and North Korea have stopped and been replaced with calls for diplomacy.
The same holds true for threats against the press and the Supreme Court which will soon disappear into the void. It's a shame the threateners won't disappear into the same empty space.
Heavens Glenn, why don't you recognize the fact that the insane bloggers from the right are indeed insane, therefore, not to be engaged in any rational discussion?
ReplyDeleteThey will never condemn their own for the murderous calls they issue; they will never condemn the venom, lies, and the vitriol that their brethens exude on a regular basis.
They are not intellectualy honest, nor are they willing to engage into any kind of rational debate.
They exist purely to spew extreme right-wing propaganda (shades of dicatorship, anyone?) and to inflame the basest primary feelings of their already bigoted, ignorant, stupid, base.
Ms. Frisch underestimated the powerful need of the neocon chickenhawk to attack the weak and foolish.
ReplyDeleteOf course more cunning and strong opponents (at Goldsteins blog) would have been subject to detailed fantasies about imaginary cock slappings and resulting applause from those who enjoy thinking about such things.
So maybe she sacrificed herself on the alter of “banality of evil” ?
Heavens Glenn, why don't you recognize the fact that the insane bloggers from the right are indeed insane, therefore, not to be engaged in any rational discussion?
ReplyDeleteI'll try this again:
Do you think that when Republicans send out flyers or broadcast television commercials or radio rants which mock John Kerry or Michael Moore or Barbara Streisand or Ward Churchill that they are doing that because they are trying to persuade Kerry, Moore, Streisand and Churchill to change their minds about political issues?
Or do you think they are talking about those individuals in order to attach them to the Democratic Party, so that people who find those individuals unattractive will shy away from having anything to do with Democrats?
Why would you possibly assume that I talk about right-wing bloggers in order to persuade them of anything, as opposed to demonstrating to others the deceit and corruption which compose the backbone of the Republican party in its current form?
BTW, Glenn I totally agree with you about going after extremists.
ReplyDeleteWhat is interesting is when you really start to hit them where it hurts (the pocket book) they start freaking out and tell you to stop wasting your time on them.
When I got a dozen advertisers to leave KSFO's radio host Brian Sussman (Melanie Morgan's sometime co-host). the Sales manager from the station came on my blog (to tell me no one is getting hurt but the hourly workers and the sales people, the audience already had their minds made up, and 'why don't you fry bigger fish?'.
Next came the the anonymous treats of lawsuits, outing me and criminal investigations "for fraudulent tortious interference with a business and using the internet to comitt those crimes."
Here is the thing: Someone is also usually paying these people. They aren't doing it for free. If you are an advertiser on one of these shows, and you find out that the host is saying something really objectionable, you might want to disassociate your company and brand from them.
This is another reason to make them radioactive. Corporations are usually not really excited to tie their brands with extremists.
Sure there will be herbal pills for erections that might support them, but legit advertisers really don't want the controversy. However, they need to be made aware what they are saying and what the issue is.
Nice summing up. Any objective study would have to conclude that wishing violent thoughts upon one's political opponents, and demonizing them, is far more prevalent and much more mainstream on the right. There is no Coulter on the left.
ReplyDeleteI'm reminded of Wolcott's piece "Headhunters."
Wow, I'm surprised you had enough intellectual honesty to quote more than just the line you found so offensive. By giving the context, if anybody actually bothers to read it, they will see how full of stupidity you really are. My quote did say I felt there was no other way to win the GWOT short of nuclear war... but I STILL DON'T WANT IT TO HAPPEN. (Who would?)
ReplyDeleteAnd btw, if you turn on your second neuron for a few minutes, instead of crippling yourself by only using half your brain, you might have realized that my comment could have been much more easily twisted into support for your idiotic "quagmire" position than support for the "insanity" of the right.
I'm not holding my breath waiting for a thank you.
RH
Anonymous RH,
ReplyDeleteMay I suggest you purchase Jim Beam or Jack Daniels or other American made? And please be absolutely sure to know what you are doing if you are making your own alcoholic beverages.
My quote did say I felt there was no other way to win the GWOT short of nuclear war... but I STILL DON'T WANT IT TO HAPPEN.
ReplyDeleteSo you want to lose the GWOT?
So where's his employer's email address so we can all complain about him?
ReplyDeleteinsane bloggers from the right are indeed insane, therefore, not to be engaged in any rational discussion?
ReplyDeleteI'll try putting the point in a slightly different form. Parody and caricature are potent political weapons. If you can characterize your opponent as an extremist that most people would find disgusting then you win.
Further if your opponent really IS an extremist who is disgusting then your job should be even easier.
Glenn's advantage is that he has reality on his side. His disadvantage is that the other side doesn't care a rat's ass about reality.
And given the human mind's loose connection to reality in the first place, I have cause to worry....
But not enough to dissuade Glenn from his efforts!
By giving the context, if anybody actually bothers to read it, they will see how full of stupidity you really are. My quote did say I felt there was no other way to win the GWOT short of nuclear war... but I STILL DON'T WANT IT TO HAPPEN. (Who would?)
ReplyDeleteYou said the world would be a "better place afterwards" if we obliterated one billion Muslims out of existence, and turned their countries into radioactive glass parking lots.
You also urged -- in response to a post accusing Supreme Court Justices of treason -- that the traitors in our country be "eliminated."
In light of that, I'm satisfied with how your comment supports the point I was making, even if you ultimately and reluctantly concluded that your conscience wouldn't let you advocate the slaughter of one billion human beings.
blueperiod... not exactly... but in the real world of 2006 I don't see any other way, and that price is too high to pay.
ReplyDeleteThen again, maybe if we weren't so busy screaming at each other, if the judges weren't so busy siezing power, if the criminals in congress weren't so busy filing lawsuits asking for their offices to be temples to bribery and malfeasance free of FBI interference, if the rest of the government and even the country wasn't so partisan... in short, if we lived in a fantasy world where human nature wasn't as despicable and screwed up as it is... maybe there would be another way.
But unfortunately that fantasy land hasn't existed within our national boundaries (or within ANY nations boundaries)... well... ever.
RH
Here's the NPR link if anyone is interested -- Misha is the third quote.
ReplyDeleteThe court did not have jurisdiction. Just by hearing the case they committed -- at the VERY least -- a severely criminal act. By seizing the powers of the executive and legislative branch, they committed treason. And unfortunately the constitution does not provide for the impeachment of a supreme court member (for they surely aren't *justices*)...
ReplyDeleteIf the only way for a traitor/tyrant to be removed from power is his execution, then what else are you supposed to support? A big hug?
RH
if we lived in a fantasy world where human nature wasn't as despicable and screwed up as it is... maybe there would be another way.
ReplyDeleteFunny how the view FROM the inside always matches the view OF the outside.
The assumption that others are at least as vile as oneself seems to motivate much of the conflict that seasons otherwise peaceable lives.
phd9, careful with insulting yourself. You just claimed you are not a member of the human race.
ReplyDeleteDoes Glenn or anyone actually think that conservatives are driven by anything other than lust for power? Civility, decency and consistency mean nothing to them, unless they can use them as a way to destroy their enemies. And if they can't destroy their enemies that way, then they'll just urge their followers to kill their enemies outright, and cowardly publish their addresses in the hopes that one of them will be deranged enough to follow through.
ReplyDeletephd9, careful with insulting yourself. You just claimed you are not a member of the human race.
ReplyDeleteNo, I just suggested that if you view human nature as despicable, then it probably reflects on yourself.
Does Glenn or anyone actually think that conservatives are driven by anything other than lust for power? Civility, decency and consistency mean nothing to them, unless they can use them as a way to destroy their enemies
ReplyDeleteIt's actually much simpler than all that. Hatred is a rush. For some its the drug of choice. They then become right wingers. You're confusing cause with effect.
Why is it so hard to get people to see the benefits of attaching the Coulters and Malkins and Michas to the GOP Party as its face. Aren't the benefits of doing that glaringly obvious?
ReplyDeleteBeing a little slow on the uptake, I have no idea what the "glaringly obvious" benefits are?
Benefits for who? Towards what goal? This is a serious question.
But the GOP machine constantly expends efforts to blow up "left-wing extremists," make them radioactive, and attach them to the Democrats. Ward Churchill? Michael Moore? Harry Belafonte? If you can't see the virtues and wisdom of doing that, shouldn't the fact that those tactics are used by Rove - whom you think is such a brilliant strategiest -- convince you that it's a smart thing to do?
If you can't beat them--join them. Atwater-->Rove-->Greenwald-- reach for the sky.
2) John Kerry lost the election, in large part, becuase he ignored the right-wing extremists who were demonizing him. "Oh, just ignore them. They're too crass and low to address. They'll just go away." He ignored them, they didn't go away, and he lost. What an odd example for you to invoke in order to argue that right-wing extremists should be ignored.
This is pretty wishful thinking here. Do you have any actual data to support the assertion that "John Kerry lost the election, in large part, becuase he ignored the right-wing extremists who were demonizing him"?
I know it is conventional wisdom in certain democratic circles, and it certainly made him look weak, but did it really swing votes against Kerry? For me, the swift boat attacks made me want to vote for Kerry. Ultimately, it couldn't overcome Kerry himself.
Executive power abuses and deceitful governments don't just pop up in the abstract. They have people behind them, who support them and are responsible for their power. I think it's extremely important to talk not only about the policies but about the people behind them.
Coulter and Malkin are responsible for the NSA scandal?
Political movements are driven by personalities and individuals, not abstract concepts. Some people think we should "rise above it all" and just stand around talking abstractly in some rarified academic way purely about issues. But I'm not someone who thinks that way.
Agreed completely. There are those that use the sheer force of own their personality and those that use the sheer force of someone else's personality.
The reason we have an extreme situation in our country is because we have extremists who are on power. I can't begin to understand the line of thought which counsels that those extremists should be ignored, as though they will simply go away if they are. That just isn't reality.
You seem to be confusing the actor hired to play the "Can you hear me now?" guy with people actually making decisions at Verizon.
Quit debating David Horowitz-- it is rotting your brain. Why do want to participate in the wholesale cattle drive toward 10% voter participation?
Thank you Glenn for this ongoing series highlighting the hate speech and hypocrisy on the right.
ReplyDeleteI often wonder if no one comments on right wing eliminationist rhetoric because it is so common. Ann Coulter has made comments expressing the same sentiments as highlighted in this post, and the media pretends she is some kind of comedian or something. Then they also try to sell us the line that somehow Michael Moore = Ann Coulter so all is o.k.
I think some of the reaction is that liberals that fight actually cut against the current media narrative that liberals are wimps.
Wow, it's the Eedjitarian himself:
ReplyDeleteMy quote did say I felt there was no other way to win the GWOT short of nuclear war... but I STILL DON'T WANT IT TO HAPPEN. (Who would?)
You said (as Glenn quotes): "I’d just as soon not see us do that, however." That's certainly strong condemnation, particularly from a person who seems to be pretty vocal about what should be done to the "traitors within": "But unless the traitors within are eliminated, they will eventually bring us down." You're not shy about letting your feelings show, and the best you can muster is a "just as soon not" nuke the whole ME and more?!?!? Tell us how you really feel.
And btw, if you turn on your second neuron for a few minutes, instead of crippling yourself by only using half your brain, you might have realized that my comment could have been much more easily twisted into support for your idiotic "quagmire" position than support for the "insanity" of the right.
Not Glenn's fault that you have difficulty getting your thoughts straight. But Glenn's point was on another subject, and I'm terrrrribbbllly sorry that he didn't indulge you in discussing what you wish (or don't wish as the case may be) he had.
I'm not holding my breath waiting for a thank you.
I'll give you one: Thanks for the laugh.
Cheers,
Thelastnamechosen: Your entire response to Glenn, every word of it, dwells in a jaw-droppingly naive world where Fox News, David Horowitz, Antonin Scalia, Ann Coulter, right-wing blogs, Alan Keyes, Bill Frist, Karl Rove, Rick Santorum, Oral Roberts, Pat Robertson, right-wing talk show hosts, Rush Limbaugh, and the rest of their "irrational" ilk have had absolutely nothing to do with (1) the Republican victories of the last two decades, (2) the expansion of power in the executive branch, (3) the appointments to the Supreme Court, (4) the dismantlement of government services, and (5) our entry into the Iraqi War.
ReplyDeleteI guess you win: in your ideal and rational world, just ignoring all of them will make them all go away.
Unbelievable.
A very confused anonymous Rottweiler said:
ReplyDeleteThe court did not have jurisdiction....
Ummm, they said they did. They explained their reasoning (perhaps a foreign concept, I know). It won the day amongst the august members of the Supreme Court. You, OTOH, haven't explained why you think they were wrong in their interpretation.
... Just by hearing the case they committed -- at the VERY least -- a severely criminal act....
Oh, really. And that crime would be:
________ USC § ______?
... By seizing the powers of the executive and legislative branch, they committed treason....
Huh? Nonsense. They said that Dubya acted contrary to the laws of Congress.
... And unfortunately the constitution does not provide for the impeachment of a supreme court member (for they surely aren't *justices*)...
A perfect example of an eedjitarian Rottweiler, I'd say. Certainly no concept of elementary civics.
If the only way for a traitor/tyrant to be removed from power is his execution, then what else are you supposed to support? A big hug?
The "only way" is a "straw man" of you own making. But the underlying sentiment is misdirected.
Cheers,
Greenwald:
ReplyDeleteDo you think that when Republicans send out flyers or broadcast television commercials or radio rants which mock John Kerry or Michael Moore or Barbara Streisand or Ward Churchill that they are doing that because they are trying to persuade Kerry, Moore, Streisand and Churchill to change their minds about political issues?
(cleansed for the sensitive eyes)
Holy snit slurpers!
Yes, Glenn again is trying to equivocate my anger with theirs. Michael Moore is a boob or 2 at least. "Clean Underwear and ramen noodles for all!" Ok, sorry.
Dude, you're defending. Stop defending. You've said it yourself.
Please select who center and left bloggers and press have wasted time attacking in the the run-up to the election...
ReplyDeleteHere is an interesting example.
A security contractor in Iraq recently plagiarized comments from a favourite wingnut blog, Iraq The Model. The Wall Street Journal then posted a summary of this contractor's brief in The Washington Wire. Thus have wingnut opinions and lies all-too-often creeped out into the MSM as "facts" and memes which, ironically, the wingnuts then cite as proof of their own assertions.
In this case, however, the incident was picked up (though not pursued) by someone at Democratic Underground. Two and a half hours later, the WSJ updated their story with a clarification. Links here for anyone interested (latest news: WSJ is now waiting for the contractor to investigate themselves).
BTW, that ITM blog was oft cited as an excellent source of positive news on Iraq by none other than Paul Wolfowitz, who arranged for the ITM authors to meet Bush in the White House.
It should be noted that not only did I, on this very blog, call for my own death. I have yet to condemn myself for it. That fact paints me in a light that, quite frankly, I don't approve of:)
ReplyDeletemichael said:
ReplyDeleteI really would like to know where the line is with these sick bastards.
Well, considering they spent the day saying that lefties whould be forced to watch the new beheading video so we can 'understand' what terrorists are like, I really don't think they have a line.
Their obsession with violence is more than a bit disturbing.
Btw, I had a commenter who said "all liberals heads should be cut off". Can I now write a post condemning the entire the entire right-wing blogosphere for remaining silent about that? After all, that person must have been one of their leaders. /snark
Glenn: This is probably not the correct place for this question, but you have a number of posts regarding the extremism of the "right" or "Bush-followers" or whatever you want to call them. You also mention that such behavior is not as prominent on the "left".
ReplyDeleteIn your book you say (Preface): "My primary political belief was that both parties were plagued by extremists ..."
I am wondering if you still feel that way? Can you identify important characters among the Dems that you consider "extremist"? Perhaps you were wrong in the beginning: Extremisms pretty much was one-sided?
In short, I am wondering if your explorations into the "political" arena has changed your view on the equality of extremism between the two parties?
From Glenn's post in re: vile & violent comments in blogs:
ReplyDelete"one might be tempted to think that this absolute lack of condemnation was a tacit acceptance of these tactics." [...] given that such rhetoric flows not merely from obscure commenters on right-wing blogs, but also from the Right's leading bloggers and pundits, with virtually no condemnation of any kind.
This is the nut of the matter. Top rightwing pundits use contempt-laden language for the purpose of discrediting those on the opposing side of their arguments as 'liberals' --> by definition unworthy of any respect. They do it casually, repeatedly, with impunity. At present, they are allowed to get away with this, but why should this remain the case? Many of the people who read these screeds, or listen to these folks on talk radio are not stupid. If they are continually shown that the 'mainstream' propagandists of the Republican Right are dishonorable, they will notice. Especially if the opposition is consistently tough and quick to respond. (See Jim Webb's Senate campaign for a case study.)
Many of the bigger name rightwing pundits did not indulge in the flamethrowing rot they spew now when they first got a foothold in the public eye, ~10-15 years ago. The reading/listening public wasn't inured to it then, and they would have failed to acquire an audience. Don't think that their audience is not still in play. You can chip away at the better portion of it if you can remind them of who they were and who they are and should be. Glenn is correct to focus on the dishonorable character of the rightwing propagandists' hivemind.
I do not understand why any rational person would attempt to engage in a debate with those who have no interest in listening. Why do people go to places like Protein Wisdom with the expectation that they will not be assaulted for disagreeing?
ReplyDeleteConrad's Ghost @ 12:41 AM said...
ReplyDeleteIt didn't take the hershey squirters at LGF this long to get here last time. Misha's people tend to be more trepidatious because they are actually a smidge brighter.
d. cloyce smith,
ReplyDeleteThat is quite a list of boogeymen. I am pretty sure I didn't say or believe that people on your list "have had absolutely nothing to do with" the issues we are trying to contented with. Hell, Santorum, Rove and Scalia are in government and thanks to your post, Alan Keyes PR people will now have five clippings this quarter. It would be quite a large stretch of hyperbole to come up with such a definitive statement about such a diverse list as yours.
Let me try to restate some of my points in a question. Do you think the best course is to adopt Rovian tactics and jello wrestle David Horowitz? (man boob--sweeet!)
I guess you win: in your ideal and rational world, just ignoring all of them will make them all go away.
Most certainly not. But I will be damned if I am going to throw them in the briar patch. The field they are playing on is not my soil. It has been salted by the same crew you list above and many others. I do not believe this battle will be won on dead land and chalk lines. If you go on Springer you expect chairs to be thrown. On cue. After this commercial.
Rove's brilliance is his ability to actually get people to play with his ball. Everybody on a bus to Texas. Road game again.
Unbelievable
Glen,
ReplyDeleteTheir rhetoric is shameful and until they can police them selves to get it undercontrol their credibility and those that harbor them must continue to take hits.
However, they aren't running a right-wing blogsphere they are running a cult. This was kind of obvious to many of us who watched with growing horror at the cultivation of freepers over the years, before instapundit was even a gleam in Regency's eye. Instapundit and the Power Liners seemed to have willingly sacrificed their veneer of respectability to become the next generation cult leaders.
The good thing is that unlike the organic growth of the left which sponsors multiple real popular movements that consist of large numbers of real people who particpate online and then actually go out and do things in the real world, the right blogsphere seems to be a harbor for the worst sort of cranks who thankfully do not come out of their basements, as the failed malkin/freeper trumpeted "demonstrations" continue to prove.
You cited The Truth Laid Bear to indicate someone was a #42 blog. But it appears that the blog "rankings" are as ineffective and deceptive as the right wing pulp that the leaders in the survey push.
At the top of the list we find Instapundit who supposedly has 4000+ links or something and yet his daily audience is one quarter of what Daily Kos gets. From powerline on down the daily reader ship of individual "higher ranked" sites on the right is less than atrios, who is ranked at #11 below them.
And both Instie and Michelle Malkin #1 and #2, are beaten in both average and current viewership by crooks and liars which is ranked at #26??!!
Something smells fishy with the relative values of the TTLB you cited. Particularly if consider the willingness of the larger leftist audience to, you know, actually participate in the political process with both money and time.
seth, I'll try to address this, since I am someone who engages in the activity. I go to Jeff's blog and a couple of other less popular blogs for the exact same purpose that Glenn makes these posts. I can't say that he inspired me exactly, because I was already doing it before he started his blog, but I think it is worthwhile considering there are lurkers at every blog. Glenn has a strong voice and can really make a difference. Just look at what happened wrt the NYT Travel section story. I may not change the minds of any of the commenters on the blogs I visit, but I might make a lurker think twice.
ReplyDeleteI am always polite, try to be funny, and never ever swear. You have to have control of yourself if you do it though, as we can see what results when someone loses it. Trolling on winger sites is not for the faint of heart or those with thin skins.
conrad's ghost,
ReplyDeleteYes, you are. Slooooowwww. Glad you established that, our expectations have been adjusted accordingly. Perhaps you might read Glenn's orginal post, where he explains why IN DETAIL.
Help the handicapped today and just quote it in a post for me. I am very slow and I just didn't see it in his post.
Read. Rinse. Repeat.
Again, I am very slow, will you just copy and paste and put the specific part of Glen's post you are talking about in a post.
So, responding to, pointing out, and bringing to the light of day in a calm, rational, clearly spoken and argued fashion the gutter slime tactics of the mainstream Republican Party equals being one of them? Ipso facto, Glenn is a criminal! Jeez, yer cracking me up! Now we see where you are going, and where you come from.
Actually, I was talking about this quote from Glenn relating to "the benefits of attaching the Coulters and Malkins to the GOP Party as its face."
But the GOP machine constantly expends efforts to blow up "left-wing extremists," make them radioactive, and attach them to the Democrats. Ward Churchill? Michael Moore? Harry Belafonte? If you can't see the virtues and wisdom of doing that, shouldn't the fact that those tactics are used by Rove - whom you think is such a brilliant strategiest -- convince you that it's a smart thing to do?
I will argue against the propriety and the effectiveness of such techniques. I see it as feeding the hand that bites you. I have no problem getting dirty or slaughtering the fowl while the meat is still tender, but I will return to my original question. Benefits for who? Towards what goal?
Oooooh, the "data" threat. First a logical fallacy (natural equivalency, natch, one of y'alls favorites)...
For us slow folks, who is y'alls?
"[Coulter and Malkin] are responsible for their POWER." Read. Rinse. Repeat. Here, our Kerry-voting (!) troll is shifting from the general ("power") to the specific ("NSA scandal) in order to attempt to discredit Glenn's argument, by misrepresenting (i.e., lying about) Glenn's statement.
My perception of the power structure seem to be inverted from yours. In my view, Coulter, Malkin and Horowitz are low rent Howard Stern rip offs, who troll unsophisticated political partisans, milking that cow for every penny and column inch of press they can get. If the internet teaches you one thing, trolling political partisans is the fishing of men in a barrel. Or is it shooting? Be vewy quiet. I am hunting wabbit holes.
Now the personal slur. Here we have Glenn as an also-ran, one who is riding the coattails of those (i.e., the very ones he is bringing to task) who so obviously have "sheer force of... personality." Here again, calling to account the vitriolic, mendacious, soulless, gutless, chickenshit lying cowards, the gutter slime of the Right's attack machine is not only pointless, it is a personal defect. Classic Rovian attempt to turn your strengths against you. Except it is you, douchebag, who is the abject follower,...
You are correct, that was a little snarky. Said another way-- You are only as great as the enemies you choose.
...as are all BushCo Rethuglicans.
I hope you can still get off if I tell you that I am not a Rethuglican. (which by the way may be the stupidest word since "whack" hit suburban America)
You're pathetic.
I love you.
Looking for a forum to troll? One of the better Xtian theoratic-neocon sites is Spengler's Forum. He writes for ATimes.com. His big idea is the eventual demise of western, Xtian civilization which will happen because of declining birth rates in Europe combined with Moslem immigration.
ReplyDeletemichael wrote:
ReplyDeleteI'm well aware they have no line when it comes to decency. I'm talking about the legal line. Does Glenn truly believe that anything short of Misha handing a gun to a fellow wingnut in front of Justice Kennedy's dwelling and saying, 'you know what to do' is protected speech?
I assumed Glenn would not believe that this type of speech would be protected. Making death threats is a chargeable offense. You'll have to ask him to clarify.
As a Canadian with much stricter hate speech laws that prevent these types of incitements, I have asked Glenn once to post his views on the differences between the laws in both countries, but he's a busy guy and who am I to tell him what to do? ;)
(I don't deny that our hate speech laws can be subject to abuse, but I do support them in general. I also disagree with those who say that such laws keep the dangerous people hidden. I haven't seen any data to back that up.)
And both Instie and Michelle Malkin #1 and #2, are beaten in both average and current viewership by crooks and liars which is ranked at #26??!!
ReplyDeleteSomething smells fishy with the relative values of the TTLB you cited. Particularly if consider the willingness of the larger leftist audience to, you know, actually participate in the political process with both money and time.
Yes. It is misleading and I do not know all the particulars except that they all link to one another constantly by design. (Kos made them do it on his orders).
Daily Kos gets three times as many hits daily as the entire RW blogosphere. It is still no argument to ignore these buffoons.
The entire left blogosphere surpassed all of cable news in the prime 25-54 year old demo over a year ago.
last name chosen...I hope you can still get off if I tell you that I am not a Rethuglican. (which by the way may be the stupidest word since "whack" hit suburban America)
ReplyDeleteYou must be an Altmouse. Google it.
I'd rather deal with a Rethuglican. At least they have some balls. Tiny, but they are there.
Glenn,
ReplyDeleteThanks to the magic of archives, you can read what Democratic bloggers wrote the day after Kerry's defeat. Lot's of good stuff there, but here's my favorite, from Atrios:
The people who voted George Bush and the Republicans into office this year didn't do so because they were conned by a right wing asshole posing as a compassionate centrist. They did so precisely because he is a right wing asshole. Yes, the modern Republican party consists of nasty bigots and liars and the media rarely bothers to point out just how nasty they are (all the talking heads talking about the role of "moral values" in the election know that what that really means is "fag hating," but they won't say it). But, don't be fooled - people know what they voted for.
Yet here we are, almost two years later, trying to convince people they are being conned when they already know it...and will vote Republican again in less than 4 months.
If things are so bad under the Republicans, don't just say it...find proof and share it with America.
Of course, this is the same Supreme Court that earlier decided in Kelo that private property rights only matter as long as a private company doesn’t offer a better deal, above or below the table, to local authorities, so one shouldn’t really be surprised. The unelected, black-robed tyrants have a long history of not giving a fig about the Constitution if they don’t like what it says, not to mention a long tradition of usurping the powers of the legislative and executive branch by ruling by judicial fiat. . . .
ReplyDeleteTry doing anything to those mutilating darlings of the Supremes in order to extract life-saving intel from them, and then wait for the Supreme Whores to decide that you were “humiliating” them in doing so.
cf.
"The last decision of the Supreme Court that property can be appropriated not only for public interest by localities with the eminent domain low. Now it can be used to appropriate private property and give it at cut-rate prices to a private developer who should pay market prices if they want to make money. This is a good prescription to be abused by unscrupulous city fathers to squise more tax money AND appropriate for themselves some of it.
Further deconstructing the Constitution by the Constitutional Judges for their political aims, like it is a piece of art in a Soho Art gallery, is further eroding the liberties of Americans the right to own properties undisturbed based on the Constitution I am not surprised which judges made the decisions and why. The liberal side of the Supreme Court to squeeze out more taxes to give it to the 'needy' in other words support income redistribution."
You know who wrote that? The maniac who blew up that building in NYC.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,202916,00.html
Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteThe court did not have jurisdiction. Just by hearing the case they committed -- at the VERY least -- a severely criminal act. By seizing the powers of the executive and legislative branch, they committed treason. And unfortunately the constitution does not provide for the impeachment of a supreme court member (for they surely aren't *justices*)...
The federalist No. 80
The fourth point rests on this plain proposition, that the peace of the WHOLE ought not to be left at the disposal of a PART.
"The Union will undoubtedly be answerable to foreign powers for the conduct of its members. And the responsibility for an injury ought ever to be accompanied with the faculty of preventing it. As the denial or perversion of justice by the sentences of courts, as well as in any other manner, is with reason classed among the just causes of war, it will follow that the federal judiciary ought to have cognizance of all causes in which the citizens of other countries are concerned."
This is not less essential to the preservation of the public faith, than to the security of the public tranquillity. A distinction may perhaps be imagined between cases arising upon treaties and the laws of nations and those which may stand merely on the footing of the municipal law. The former kind may be supposed proper for the federal jurisdiction, the latter for that of the States. But it is at least problematical, whether an unjust sentence against a foreigner, where the subject of controversy was wholly relative to the lex loci, would not, if unredressed, be an aggression upon his sovereign, as well as one which violated the stipulations of a treaty or the general law of nations. And a still greater objection to the distinction would result from the immense difficulty, if not impossibility, of a practical discrimination between the cases of one complexion and those of the other.
"So great a proportion of the cases in which foreigners are parties, involve national questions, that it is by far most safe and most expedient to refer all those in which they are concerned to the national tribunals."
Federalist No. 80 indicates that you are wrong as to whether the Supreme Court had juridiction. So perhaps you should try doing some research before suggesting justices should be hung for performing duties which they were expressly established to perform.
the lastnamechosen said: Hell, Santorum, Rove and Scalia are in government and thanks to your post, Alan Keyes PR people will now have five clippings this quarter. It would be quite a large stretch of hyperbole to come up with such a definitive statement about such a diverse list as yours.
ReplyDeleteThe list was diverse and in no particular order for a reason you didn't grasp: where would you dry the line?
1) Coulter, Malkin, Glenn Reynolds, Hinderaker, Horowitz
2) Santorum, Cornyn, Rohrabacher, DeLay, Duke Cunningham, Jack Abramoff, J.C. Watts
How are these two groups different in ideology and tactics? I'm sure you would argue the second group has "power." And I would point out that at one time they were all members of group #1.
Are you really arguing that you would have us wait until members of the first group actually hold office or have power or are appointed to government positions before we "engage" with them?
And don't say you don't think it will happen: that's a bogus argument. Look at that second group again. It already has happened. (Need I remind you that one of the right-wing bloggers involved in this melee--who proudly boasts the "Powerline News" emblem on his site and who high-fives Malkin every chance he gets--is a Los Angeles county prosecutor. You don't think he might have higher political ambitions? What office shall we "wait" for him to hold before we can finally address his nonsense.)
Some of us can't keep living in that kind of denial. Your approach is no different than all those folks who argued, 15-20 years ago, that George W. Bush could never be elected President. Well, guess what?
Did you forget that Keyes used to be an assistant Secretary of State? He became one because everyone ignored the fact that he was a barking moonbat. And one of the reasons Keyes is no longer in office is because he became a joke. This didn't happen by everyone ignoring him.
Frankly, I'd rather embarrass all these folks now, turning them into jokes, while their power is still limited.
Glenn: "Finally, for everyone who writes me e-mails or leaves comments telling me I'm wasting my time or energies or whatever talking about people such as this, please realize it's futile. I totally disagree and I'm going to continue to talk about them."
ReplyDeleteYou go, Glenn! Keep verbally wacking them along side their heads! These nasty folks are a spreading disease, and they need to be called out ALL THE TIME.....
"Executive power abuses and deceitful governments don't just pop up in the abstract. They have people behind them, who support them and are responsible for their power. I think it's extremely important to talk not only about the policies but about the people behind them."
Amen, amen.....the Coulters and Malkins shouldn't get away with the crap they write. People watching their "show" should hear the voice of reason OVER and OVER AGAIN......
"Political movements are driven by personalities and individuals, not abstract concepts. Some people think we should "rise above it all" and just stand around talking abstractly in some rarified academic way purely about issues. But I'm not someone who thinks that way. The reason we have an extreme situation in our country is because we have extremists who are on power. I can't begin to understand the line of thought which counsels that those extremists should be ignored, as though they will simply go away if they are. That just isn't reality."
yeah, and reality sucks!
keep on truckin' Glenn....you give me hope each and every day.....
What this woman said was vile, and she is probably a pretty disturbed person, but it was not a death threat.
ReplyDeleteFor people who consider a statement that she'd rejoice in hearing of the kid's death to be a death threat, I'd like to know their take on this post by Thomas (admin of RedState, one of the biggest conservative blogs, not some obscure unknown nobody like this woman):
"I repeat: Should the entire American Left fall over dead tomorrow, I would rejoice, and order pizza to celebrate. They are not my countrymen; they are animals who happen to walk upright and make noises that approximate speech. They are below human. I look forward to seeing each and every one in Hell."
By those standards of what is an expression of murderous intentions, isn't Thomas up there with Hitler and Stalin? Actually, he's even worse -- Hitler and Stalin never tried to murder half their countries' population, you have to go to Pol Pot for that.
This stuff is in fact regular fare in mainstream conservative blogs, those with the largest audiences. On the liberal side you'll only hear it from people on the fringes that nobody reads (and thank God for that) -- and even there it doesn't seem to be quite as bad as what you get in 'mainstream' right-wing blogs (need I mention LGF?...)
Still, this hanging by the neck thing could be a powerful tool in the Hillary Clinton administration. Let's not dismiss it too quickly.
ReplyDeleteanonymous said,
ReplyDeleteYou must be an Altmouse. Google it.
You are going to have to define this one for me, I don't keep up on the sub-sub-sub-sub labeling of political beliefs. Or is this just some kind of code word?
I'd rather deal with a Rethuglican. At least they have some balls. Tiny, but they are there.
Ummm.... It is good to know that whatever you have planned involves Rethuglicans, testicles and the ability to measure them.
d. cloyce smith,
First of all we have to stop mentioning Alan Keyes, his PR "department" is really just a tax dodge involving his wife and she is not supposed to be doing any work.
I don't remember putting forth the proposition that somehow small fish should be ignored or spared. I agree with the tactic of "slaughtering the fowl while the meat is still tender." I think there may be some middle ground between ignoring someone and fueling book sales. What I don't understand is getting suckered into a knuckle fight in the alley. Based on what? False pride? Ticket sales?
CRIPPLE FIGHT!!!!
lastnamechosen... Ummm.... It is good to know that whatever you have planned involves Rethuglicans, testicles and the ability to measure them.
ReplyDeleteYou are the one who thinks American politics is a delicate affair like an afternoon tea party on the veranda. Hence your confusion between the "reach around" and testicle measurement. It's a tea party, alright, but more like the one they had that night in Boston harbor in 1773.
thelastnamechosen...You are going to have to define this one for me, I don't keep up on the sub-sub-sub-sub labeling of political beliefs. Or is this just some kind of code word?
ReplyDeleteMaybe you should stay in the kiddie politics pool until you can keep up.
Alan in SF said...
ReplyDeleteStill, this hanging by the neck thing could be a powerful tool in the Hillary Clinton administration. Let's not dismiss it too quickly
This is the one thing I just don't get. They must actually believe they are in the first few years of their own 1000 year Reich.
Bwahahahahaha!
Those who forget the lessons of history and all that...
Support for Hitler (or Fascism) in the United States
"Fanaticism consists in redoubling your effort when you have forgotten your aim."
George Santayana
Liberal Blogosphere Surpasses Cable News
ReplyDeleteDailykos Is As Large As The Entire Conservative Blogosphere
Is this you, Dipshit? Do you wish you still lived in a time when men fought "dyuells" so you could chickenhawk out and cut and run?
Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteWhy does Greenwald make the same point 1,000 times, over and over, taking 15 paragraphs when all he needed was one? What a tedious blowhard jack-ass!
Because people like your are quite slow and dense.
Thank you for calling attention to this blogger's outrageous rhetorical overkill. Of course, three trees and three ropes would be more than sufficient.
ReplyDeleteKeep up the good work.
Glenn--Great post. The truth hurts. Ironically, I'll bet a goodly number of those rabid right-wing nut jobs will end up hanging themselves.
ReplyDeleteGreat blog
Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteThank you for calling attention to this blogger's outrageous rhetorical overkill. Of course, three trees and three ropes would be more than sufficient.
Why would we wish to deface a tree with an ugly pencil-necked geek like yourself, and adorn you with a hemp neck-tie in the process? You would be over-dressed. I think a coat hook on the wall would be sufficient for a lightweight such as yourself.
Merry Fizzlemas, everyone. It appears "The Wreck of the Patrick Fitzgerald" has reached its coda.
ReplyDeleteI hope everyone had a good Frischmas as well.
Yep, this is shaping up to be one helluva summer.
I can't wait until all the recovered Iraqi documents have been translated and declassified.
I hope all you wingnuts have good recipies for crow.
Dailykos Is As Large As The Entire Conservative Blogosphere
ReplyDeleteThanks for pointing that out. It just confirms what everyone has said all along; that the left side of the blogosphere is a collection of nuts!
One of the co-founders of Daily Kos, besides being a two-bit stock scammer, actually bases his political analyses and predictions on whether or not Jupiter is aligned with Mars.
You just can't make this stuff up. Reality based community indeed.
Merry Fizzlemas!
From dipshite at 8:42am:
ReplyDeleteYou just can't make this stuff up. Reality based community indeed.
Nope, you can't, whereas the right-side of the aisle doesn't nothing but make shite up.
And yes, this is the reality-based community. Feel free to join us at any time.
I call for the impeachment of the SCOTUS judges who made a "one time ruling" to stop the vote count in Florida in 2000.
ReplyDeleteSo, the rightwingers want someone to condemn Deb Frisch? All right, I condemn her...like her, I'm a blogger that no one reads...maybe this will put me in good as a darling of the right; as if I care.
ReplyDeleteCorrect me if I’m wrong, but I think a crucial distinction here is how the “other side” is viewed by people such as the popular blogger Misha.
ReplyDeleteNow, liberal bloggers like Jeralyn Merritt over at Talk Left who took Frisch to task for her comments view Jeff Goldstein and his children as human beings. And that’s why she condemned her remarks.
But is that true of Misha? Is that still true of freepers, footballers, dittoheads, Malkinites, Coulterites, and Savagistas?
Think about that for a moment. Are liberals human beings? Or, have they been dehumanized to the point that talking about their extermination is politically acceptable?
Has the right been so successful in demonizing the term “liberal” that it is now the equivalent of “raghead” “Hadji” “gook” etc. – terms that de-humanize others and allow for their indiscriminate killing without regard for their basic humanity.
The first step was to equate the term “liberal” with being “godless” “immoral” “traitors” who support “Saddam” “Al Qaeda” and “terrorism” and who “hate America.”
The next step is to accentuate the “danger” they pose to this country. The “blabbermouths” at the New York Times are giving away secrets to the enemy. The “liberals” want to “wave the white flag of surrender” they want to “cut and run” they are cowards whose views support the “enemy” they are in league with the people trying to bring harm to this country.
That’s why there is serious talk about gas chambers for these liberal Jews in the media (Punch S.) who are seen as openly working for the terrorists.
And we are now entering the final stage which is to regard these “liberals” this “enemy within” as “vermin” – they are the “HIV virus” that is weakening this country’s defenses- its morals, values and religion, its police and military.
What do you do with vermin? You exterminate them. What do you want to do with the HIV virus? You want to kill it.
This is the rhetorical playing field we now live in. And that’s it why it was outrageous for someone to say vile things about Jeff Goldstein and his children, but not a problem for Misha to say anything he wants – he’s saying it about “liberals” after all, so it’s not vile, he’s exercising free speech which is his right.
So, in this context (which is the “reality’ the right has created for itself) it is wrong to call for harm to come to Bush supporters, but perfectly acceptable to call for the death of “liberals.”
What Glenn Greenwald is doing is exposing the fraudulence of this whole rhetorical playing field we live in for what it is by pointing out the absurdities, the contradictions, the hypocrisy, and immorality of it all.
And that’s why people in right blogostan hate Greenwald so much - he shines a light on what they are doing, who they really are, and how dangerous they’ve become.
talking points said "Correct me if I am wrong, but . . . "
ReplyDeleteThanks for that very cogent post - good insights.
Rob
I find it somewhat hard to understand how someone (like some commenters here), can NOT see the difference between misha's hyperbole*, and DF's ramblings about the 2 year old son of an opponent... seriously... "You hit me, I hit your child"... As for the pathetic attempts to argue the case of DF comments being tampered with... seriously.. the evidence that this is NOT the case is by now so large that even trying to say that wit a straight face should qualify for an oscars immediately...
ReplyDelete- and for the record, I am not republican..
* which can be quite graphic in nature indeed, but ALWAYS directed against those who he disagrees with, in this case the 5 judges.
For some reason, comments like these remind me of Al Franken's observation about how conservatives (or neocons, I guess) love their country - as a 4-year-old loves mommy. Mommy is perfect and can do no wrong, so anybody who says bad things about mommy is evil and has to die. (makes about as much sense as tagging 5/4's of the current Supreme Court as "liberals".)
ReplyDeleteFor the 33% of the Truly Faithful left in this country, I think that extremely stunted emotional growth is the only possible explanation.
This is a complete waste of time. Why not address the Pentagon memo today regarding Gitmo and Geneva, as it appears at first glance to directly contradict your premise of an imperial presidency
ReplyDeleteAllow me to disabuse you of your fantasies that this is not an "imperial presidency" or of your (implied) belief that the Pentagon always afforded Geneva Conventions/humane treatment upon detainees. See, unlike you, I serve in the actual military. I am an officer in said military. Unlike you, I know of what I speak in this regard.
About 6 months or so ago, we received our annual LOAC briefing (Law of Armed Conflict) from our local JAG office. Typically, this has meant watching a (well made) video from the top JAG at the Pentagon about the Law of Armed Conflict, the Geneva Conventions, and the like. This time, however, it was different. This time we got a rambling, somewhat off-the-cuff briefing from our local JAG (an LtCol) about the LOAC and Geneva. He presented, in rather laughing and definitely dismissive manner, that the Geneva Conventions do not apply to enemy combatants acquired in this war. He directly said that. He didn't imply it, he stated flat-out that though the LOAC applies, the niceties of the Geneva Conventions do not.
I was appalled. That briefing haunts me still. Prior to that briefing I had liked and respected the local JAG. That briefing tossed all that out the window. He was not offering his individual opinion, he was briefing the official line.
The Pentagon statement that the military position has always been to treat detainees in accordance with the Geneva Conventions is total bullshit. A lie.
Sit down and shut your mouth. You have nothing to say and nothing to offer this discussion. You, like the leadership in the Pentagon, are full of shit.
Mr Glenn Greenwald,
ReplyDeleteI see that Patterico (AKA) Patrick Frey is calling you a Douchebag on his website.
I have been following this Deb Frisch situation. I have posted on Mr. Goldstien's Blog Protein Wisdom also, mostly talking about a Children's Toy Named "Mr. Bath Bear." The Responses I got from people on his website were at best, DISPICABLE, with the exeption of one poster who had a tiny bit of interest in Helping The Children who came into contact with this Illegal Product. I am hoping there are some people who post on your blog who "Legitimately" Care for children, who will help me expose to the public this Mr. Bath Bear Situation.
You can read more about it on My "My Space Website:
http://www.myspace.com/mariognitrini111
Patterico (AKA) Los Angeles County Assistant District Attorney Patrick Frey, accused me of Stalking him (GOOD GRIEF) on Jeff Goldstien's Blog, with this Comment on this Protein Wisdom thread:
Monday, July 10, 2006
So long, and thanks for all the Frisch
Patterico? Mr. Frey?
How about Legally looking into The Mr. Bath Bear Situation I have Laid out?
Mr Frey, You are an Assistant Los Angeles County District Attorney, and I would think you would want to help the Children who were Victims of this Mr. Bath Bear Toy, Wouldn’t you?
MarioGeorgeNitrini111
mariogeorgenitrini111
______
The OJ Simpson Case
See? And Jeff thinks he’s the only guy with a stalker!
At least *his* stalker lives in a different state! This guy lives right here in L.A.! And he’s been to prison! And he stalks the Internet looking for anywhere my true name is mentioned! Because he considers me an “Illegal, LYING, Deceptive, COWARD” (as he says in any of his numerous comments about me throughout the Web).
And *why* am I an “Illegal, LYING, Deceptive, COWARD”? Because he left a comment on my site accusing an L.A. Times reporter of complicity in a murder, with no evidence, and I cleaned up the comment and banned him.
Because we all know how protective I am of L.A. Times reporters. So I *must* be HIDING THE TRUTH!
So don’t pretend *you’re* the only guy with a stalker, Mr. Jeff Goldstein!
Posted by Patterico | permalink
on 07/11 at 01:49 AM
My Response to The LYING HYPOCRICAL COWARD Patrick Frey:
Mr. Frey (Patterico)
I’m “STALKING” YOU? You are one “SCARED” Paranoid person. I’m “NOT” stalking you.
You made LYING FALSE Allegations about me here:
Patterico�s Pontifications � Hiltzik Suspension in the Media Filed under: Dog Trainer, Hiltzik � Patterico @ 12:55 pm ... OJ Simpson case. I read Your Post of Febuary 24th, 2004 about The OJ � ... http://patterico.com/2006/04/30/4519/hiltzik-suspension-in-the-media/ - Cached
What I’ve tried to do in the past is get you to respond to me about why you LIED About me.
Since you “Banned” me from your website (GOOD GRIEF), I’ve tried to get you to converse with me on other website’s.
I’ve been to Prison. I don’t hide that fact. I asked Bill Boyarsky to put that in the Article he wrote about me with with some of my personal involvement in The OJ Simpson Case. SO?
I Just asked you here on Mr. Goldstien’s website to look into This Mr. Bath Bear Situation. And you Mr. Frey, say I’m stalking you? I’M NOT STALKING YOU Mr. Frey.
I’ll ask you again Mr. Frey:
Patterico? Mr. Frey? How about Legally looking into The Mr. Bath Bear Situation I have Laid out? Mr Frey, You are an Assistant Los Angeles County District Attorney, and I would think you would want to help the Children who were Victims of this Mr. Bath Bear Toy, Wouldn’t you?
MarioGeorgeNitrini111
mariogeorgenitini111SE
Posted by mariogeorgenitrini111 | permalink
on 07/11 at 10:52 AM
Patrick Frey "BANNED" me from his website last April 30th, 2006 for telling the truth.
MarioGeorgeNitrini111
mariogeorgenitrini111
________________
The OJ Simpson Case
http://tinseltowncoldcase.blogspot.com/
In case anyone's still inerested
ReplyDeletehttp://altmouse.blogspot.com/
Unfortunatly, the last post is from April 11.
From the major at 11:00am:
ReplyDeleteWell as usual liberals just don't get it. It is clearly a joke to say hang the justices.
This comment is a very good argument for the mandatory retroactive abortion of all registered Republicans ages 18 and up. No sense in allowing the gene pool of our species to be polluted with the likes of these 'things'.
I am joking of course. Don't you see me laughing?
If our military can't find the dicipline to shut up and follow the orders they get
ReplyDeleteWe are legally and morally obliged to disobey any and all illegal orders. YOU would have us follow orders blindly. Your is a recipe for Nuremburg arguments (that fail, and rightly so) that "I was just following orders".
You want to take part in an occupation so bad JOIN and volunteer, post haste, to go to Iraq.
There is no more war in Iraq, it is an occupation. The war ended with the capture of Baghdad. Everything since has been an (incompetent) occupation.
War is what is going on (incompetently) in Afghanistan, though that too borders on occupation now. The difference is that Afghanistan was justified while Iraq can never ever be justified.
Oh, and violating the Geneva Conventions and the Conventions Against Torture and inhumane treatment are also unjustifiable. Ever.
When you sign up for military service you take an oath to follow your commands and not to undermine our troops. This guy didn't take that oath seriously
ReplyDeleteAsshole. My oath was, first and foremost, to "protect and defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign or domestic" and to obey lawful orders. I took (and take) that oath very seriously. Very seriously.
There is no legal mechanism to reverse a "stolen" election, if that's what it was.
ReplyDeleteOther than this, you mean.
.
"Nobody needs to wade through the depths of comment sections to find this rhetoric on the Right,"
ReplyDelete"No need to?" .. Then why did you?
"No need to?" .. Then why did you?
ReplyDeleteNo need to wade in to find it because it is right there, floating on top like a turd.
Greenwald is a hypocrite.
ReplyDeleteAre commenters "in" or "out" of these discussions?
His current formulation is the minor, unimportant people like Deb Frisch, Ward Churchill, and DU commenters are not relevant, while Misha's and LGF's commenters are relevant.
*shrug* His adoring minions don't care.
michael:
ReplyDeleteI don't think that method is legal......
Oh, it's specified in the Highest Law of the Land (or so do the wingnuts characterise it when they want to insist that the mention of "Creator" and "nature and [] nature's God" makes this a Chris'shun nation), the Declaration of Independence:
"... it is their Right, it is their Duty, to throw off such Government,..."
Then there's Jefferson's comment: "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
Cheers,
From the commissar at 12:29pm:
ReplyDeleteHis current formulation is the minor, unimportant people like Deb Frisch, Ward Churchill, and DU commenters are not relevant, while Misha's and LGF's commenters are relevant.
Nice try, but inaccurate. Its not a question of 'relevance' (if it were, Misha and the LGF crew wouldn't even be a subject of discussion), but of message saturation and content.
Put it another way: precisely how many pundits, commentators, and radio show hosts are parrotting the sentiments of Frisch, Churchill, or the DU or Kos commentators almost line-for-line?
The "Commissar":
ReplyDelete[Glenn]: "Nobody needs to wade through the depths of comment sections to find this rhetoric on the Right,"
"No need to?" .. Then why did you?
Let me type this s l o w l y so that people like the "Commissar" here can understand: Glenn didn't. He said there was no need to.
Not all that hard to understand for the sapient amongst us.
Better trolls, please.
Cheers,
Grand Moff Texan said...
ReplyDeleteThere is no legal mechanism to reverse a "stolen" election, if that's what it was.
Other than this, you mean.
That makes me want to quote that famous line in Jaws when Chief Brody says, "I think we're going to need a bigger boat."
As it turns out, they didn't need a bigger boat, but they did need another boat. ;-)
Interesting, I went through your archives and couldn't find where you condemned Randi Rhodes for playing a clip that suggested the assassination of President Bush.
ReplyDeleteHypocrisy, Greenwald is thy name.
It seems awfully weird to me how so much of the conservative movement seems cribbed from bolshevism.
ReplyDeleteYou have conservative bloggers who call themselves "commisar", you have Grover Norquist using Lenin's tactics, you have the weird & scary Bush cult, kind of like the Stalin cult (though clearly less pervasive or terroristic)...
There are other likenesses, too, which I've noticed, but I cna't think of them offhand...
Ahh, there's also the over the top demonization of political opponents and calls for thier extermination. Most--but not all--of the higher politicians seem to stay away from the worst excesses; but then they have no need to indulge in it as long sa their toady commentators spew forth names like vermin and cockroaches and such.
ReplyDeleteAlso the utter disregartd for the truth, and willingness to spout the most idiotic and unbelievable lies as gospel truth with a straight face harken back to Stali's Russia.
Capitalist Infidel said...
ReplyDeleteInteresting, I went through your archives and couldn't find where you condemned Randi Rhodes for playing a clip that suggested the assassination of President Bush.
I agree. I think Glenn should condemn pretzels as well. One of them actually tried to kill the preznit.
Does anyone else notice anything wrong in this comment from the rottweiller:
ReplyDeleteOf course, this is the same Supreme Court that earlier decided in Kelo that private property rights only matter as long as a private company doesn’t offer a better deal, above or below the table, to local authorities, so one shouldn’t really be surprised.
Someone should mention that if you are going to go to the extremes of calling for someones murde by lynching that at least you could use back up of the facts. The fact is that this IS NOT the "same" Supreme Court that made the imminent domain ruling, this court has two new members, scAlito and Roberts (although Roberts had to recuse himself in Hammdan). The court that made the imminent domain decision was the one with O'Connor and Reihnquist.
Are they intentionally obtuse? (rhetorical question as we ALL know the answer to that...)
Capitalist Infidel
ReplyDeleteAge: 41
Gender: male
Astrological Sign: Gemini
Zodiac Year: Snake
Occupation: Owner of Tumbleweeds Bar and Grille
Location: Monroe : North Carolina : United States
Interests
NASCAR Football Hockey Politics
Favorite Movies
To Kill a Mockingbird One Flew Over the Cukoo's Nest
Favorite Music
Country
Favorite Books
Slander Treason Give Me A Break Why the Left Hates America Off With Their Heads Bias Arrogance The Death of Right and Wrong
He harbors terrorist pretzels in his bar! He's a hypocrite and an assassin!
capitalist infidel said: "condemned Randi Rhodes for playing a clip that suggested the assassination of President Bush"
ReplyDeleteI hadn't heard that she'd made such a comment, but I don't listen to the radio much. Is there a citation for her statement?
Regardless, if she did say it, I guess I'm confused. Wouldn't that comment fall under the category clarified by the major earlier in the postings? That is to say, a joke about a public figure? If so, then I guess you must be a liberal, which, as the major also clarified, are individuals without a sense of humor and lacking the ability to recognize a joke. According to the major, if Rhoads had made a comment about the children of a private citizen, well, then clearly she would be a terrorist, or terrorist sympathizer, or similar.
Luckily, there is never any inconsistency or hypocrisy amongst the current administration and its adherents. Luckily, all the hypocrisy in the universe is contained in Glenn Greenwald, as you have noted.
I'll add the "/sarcasm" tag now, in case it isn't obvious.
Rob
Glenn:
ReplyDeleteIn case you have not already seen it, Justice has responded to a letter from Senator Schumer asking whether Hamden affected Justice's position on the NSA Program and FISA.
http://lawculture.blogs.com/lawculture/files/
NSA.Hamdan.response.schumer.pdf
In short, Justice argues that the NSA Program is more likely to fall under the reasoning of the Hamdi decision rather than the Hamden decision concerning the AUMF. In reality, who knows? It all depends on what side of the bed Kennedy gets up on if the question came before him.
More interestingly, Justice concludes by implying that none of this matters because Congress had no Constitutional authority in the first instance to regulate intelligence gathering like it did to set rules for the treatment of Captures.
In the end, this is always the determinative issue.
Misha's pining for the deaths of Supreme Court Justices is outrageous and contemptible.
ReplyDeleteDeb Frisch's vague threats toward Jeff Goldstein's kid were outrageous and contemptible.
Confederate Yankee's hypothesis that Deb Frisch is emblematic of the entire left was outrageous and contemptible.
Glenn Greenwald's hypothesis that Misha is emblematic of the entire right is outrageous and contemptible.
Glenn Greenwald's claim that deranged rhetoric on the left is confined to obscure blog commenters that no one has ever heard of is nonsense on stilts.
The blogospheric "gotcha!" game was tiresome and stupid years ago.
The tendency of certain bloggers to demand that other bloggers write about thus-and-so is also tiresome and stupid.
Did I about cover everything?
Back in late Jan or early Feb I'd left a comment here in response to Jeff with a bit from the FISA statute -and noted the same thing at his site (but I've looked and can't find the exact one...sorry). It just cited a piece I believe about FISA being operative during war time (under sec. 1811).
ReplyDeleteAfter that I got email from someone asking me if I'd been banned:
"Did you get banished too for challenging Goldstein, or was it just me?
Keep up the good work, Regards."
Apparently ole Jeff can't handle any factual challenges on his site and deleted my comment.
I said at the time in reply to my emailer: I do recall leaving a copy of the the identical comment I left on Unclaimed Territory over at Protein Wisdom for Goldstein...but it's not there.
If he deleted it...I really couldn't care much - cept that it proves if that mere factual recitation ( and I've never called him names or anyone on that page anything offensive- except wrong on the FACTS) is too much for him...so be it.
And I Do NOT try to encourage debates with troll-commentators like that. It's mostly unproductive and exhausting too.
But tells ya where his little closed-mined world stops...at the door of his own lies and disinformation blog. Cant let any LIGHT of facts nor reason in that dank cell.
Did Goldstein ban her IP?
ReplyDeleteIf he did at some point early in the exchanges and if she got around it using a proxy or anonymizing software, then she was indeed harassing him.
If he didn't, then he obviously wanted it to go on so he could play at being victim. He was acting as her publisher and quite possibly trying to appeal to some of his own disturbed readers with her disturbed comments.
From the major at 2:29pm:
ReplyDeleteAnd I don't appreciate people twisting my words in there context. What Randy Rhodes said doesn't count as a joke about a public figure because George W. Bush is the PRESIDENT OF THE UNTITED STATES.
Nor do I appreciate 'jokes' about the murder of JUSTICES OF THE SUPREME COURT OF THE UNITED STATES. What has been said doesn't count as a joke about public figures because these are JUSTICES OF THE SUPREME COURT OF THE UNITED STATES.
Clear enough, sir?
Rather than engage in more screaming and hair-splitting, how about this:
ReplyDeleteLet's all concede that indeed the rhetoric and comments do occasionally get extreme on both sides, some going so far to advocate the unspeakable be visited upon their opposite numbers and certain elected or appointed officials.
However, it should be further conceded that one is far, far more likely to hear this extreme rhetoric from the Right rather than the Left, and to hear it uttered not merely by little-read bloggers, but also by prominent and vocal partisans on the national airwaves and in print.
In my reading, Glenn isn't suggesting the right-wing blogsphere immediately leap upon Misha or the LGFers and unanimously condemn their every statement any more than he's suggesting everyone here on the nominal left pile unto Frisch or Rhodes (neither of whom I'd heard of before today) for their own statements.
But neither should the continued parroting of accusations of "treason" and the like be taken as just 'jokes', particularly when its being parroted almost word-for-word across both blogs and the airwaves. As Glenn already stated a few posts ago, this kind of speech may be protected under the First Amendment, but to engage in it so wontonly is not only morally questionable, its damned irresponsible.
There's a good Tom Tomorrow cartoon in Salon that hits the nail right on the head.
ReplyDeleteDid I about cover everything?
ReplyDeleteAnon,
This is a type of "seem reasonable and balanced" fallacy. You gave points to both "sides" so overall you must have got it right. Just plain "common sense"
No. Sorry, you'll need to do a lot more to demonstrate how Glenn is wrong about his characterizations of Right and Left wing blogs.
Find us some equally reprehensible comments made by prominient left wing blogs.
Find us some right wing bloggers removing links to other right wing blogs for going over the line and failing to apologize or revise.
Sometimes 1 side is just completely right (or mostly). Not everything is grey. This is one of those cases.
I decided to go check out the Misha link to see what else that person had to say.
ReplyDeleteHaving done so, I noted that Misha had a link up to what he described as some extremely upsetting pictures of atrocities done by terrorists to two guys (I think they were Americans.)
I couldn't look at the pictures because I cannot stand acts of cruelty and I have nightmares if I see pictures of them. However, for purposes of agrument let's assume the following:
l) He is convinced the pictures he posted are not propaganda but are real.
2) They in fact are as he described them and show Islamics doing very horrible things to American soldiers.
Given those two assumptions, I don't think in this particular case he can be that condemned for writing what he did.
Of course, he is also making a lot of other assumptions:
l) Generalizing that such behavior is characteristic of a group he has come to hate, rather than particular to the individuals who committed the atrocities in the pictures;
2) Concluding that the SC majority opinion is condoning and promoting such atrocities;
etc. etc. etc.
But leaving all rational analysis of these points aside, isn't it true that when someone witnesses an act of particurlarly depraved cruelty, it's human to hate the person who did it?
It's human to hate anyone one thinks is in any way defending the person who did it.
It's human to be overtaken by emotion and want anyone who one deems to be connected to the enablemnent of such depravity to be punished.
If I had to be responsible for everything I said I wouldn't mind seeing done to people who commit serial acts of extreme cruelty to animals, I'd be in trouble.
Those are just expressions of the intense emotions of the moment.
You are not saying you would do anything. You are registering how violently you object to what was done.
The Five Trees, Some Assembly required etc. does contain an certain aspect of humor and maintains that humorous distance from being in the complete grip of emotions. Thus it doesn't seem like the most vicious thing to write if those pictures are anything like what I dread they are.
I wouldn't condemn Misha for his statements about that incident unless I had looked at the pictures and found them to be not that upsetting. If they are completely intolerable, I would not pay particular attention to Misha's statements on this one point. It's a blog, not a newspaper editorial.
I don't think there's any need to stretch to make points when there's an abundant amount of proper raw material around to work with.
Glenn,
ReplyDeleteYou have reminded me why I never read Misha's blog.
And, for that matter, I stopped frequenting Goldstein's month and months ago.
I just got this email from a friend in Israel:
ReplyDeleteLooks like we may be going to war. Radio here just reported that Government officials made a statement that Israel said they are looking at the possibility of a very strongh hit on Beirut and Damsacus over 2 new kidnappings of Israeli soldiers by Hizballah. Reserves have been called up.
I have to say that the choice of title is misleading and may show some poor judgement.
ReplyDeleteIt makes you look like you "may have interpreted this protected speech as a threat against a federal judge, but it’s probably nothing more than some heated rhetoric." It casts doubt on your support for free speech, hardly the trapings of any 1st amendment lawyer.
In spite of all the smoke and mirrors on the left and right, all this crap is about is trying to convince the undecided or possible converts to "throw in" politically with whatever party the author(s)happens to be affilated with at election time.
ReplyDeleteI suppose it has occurred to the liberal folks (since, at the moment the the conservatives are in the majority in congress with a conservative president) that even if in November there are some wins and the Dems were to achieve a majority in the Senate and House, the conservatives would then be back to screaming bloody murder and obstructing as much as possible until they could get back in power, sort of like what we have now?
No matter how you look at it, nearly half the country will oppose whoever should prevail at that time.
I have an acquaintance named Bob. Bob was eternally frustrated with politics, even when his guy won. The reason for this is, Bob would believe what his candidates would say to get his vote. Then, once in office, sooner or later they would betray Bob's trust.
Bob came to realize that no matter what party these people represented, they were really in it for themselves for reasons of power, the perks that come with the office, some for the sycophantic political "groupies" hanging on their every word, fame, etc.
Why else would these wealthy people take on a job like the Senate or Presidency, which they all claim is so tough?
After much disillusion, Bob said to himself " This isn't working. I spend time and money on this effort, my guy even wins, and I still lack true representation. Then my guy and his cronies vote for pay raises and assorted other priviledges for themselves on my dime. My dime....hmmm".
Bob made the determination that the assorted clowns in office were, in general, there for the wrong reasons, and essentially accomplishing nothing but fighting amongst thelmselves to the detriment of the people they are supposed to looking out for. And, there were doing it on his dime.
Now, for the government to waste $10,000.00 or $20,000.00 is nothing, but to Bob it was a significant portion of his earnings going into the toilet with no return.
So, in order to quell the anger and disappointment within, Bob rearranged his life and now is his own boss with his own business. Bob, using legal methods, pays next to nothing in taxes now.
Bob is a much happier fellow now that he is no longer underwriting those elected clods. He can get on with enjoying his life as he no longer has a dog in the political hunt.
I think Bob may have the right idea.
Z
From the major at 3:30pm:
ReplyDeleteAndwho was it who tried to bring discredit on George W. Bush by printed baseless lies about his service in the military.
Which 'baseless lies' are we talking about?
The ones where the President claimed he'd served his term without missing any physicals? Or the ones where he claimed he'd release all his records?
From anonymous at 3:36pm:
ReplyDeleteI think Bob may have the right idea.
Nice advert for entrepenuership.
What's your point?
PSA: You will understand The Major much better if you just replace "THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES" with "KING" (or you can use "OUR LORD, THE KING".
ReplyDeleteThen his arguments will make some sense, for a loyalist.
Capitalist Infidel said...
ReplyDeleteInteresting, I went through your archives and couldn't find where you condemned Randi Rhodes for playing a clip that suggested the assassination of President Bush.
GG started his blog 1 year, 5 months after Rhodes said that.
And apparently the Major hadn't heard that Coulter said the only question regarding Clinton should be whether to impeach or assassinate.
Grow a brian.
ReplyDeleteMy all-time favorite major comment ever.
Dan, that you think one side in this kerfuffle is mostly on the side of angels amply demonstrates that you're as much of an insufferable partisan crank as this blog's proprietor. You want examples of prominent lefty opinionistas saying something as deranged as what Misha said? Check out the complete works of Ted Rall. Check out Markos "Screw Them" Zuniga.
ReplyDeleteYou want examples of prominent righty opinionistas condemning the idiotic remarks of their fellow-travellers? Check out Patterico's response to Greenwald (calling Misha's rantings "ridiculous and outrageous", and linking to condemnations of Bill O'Reilly and Michael Savage). Check out Sister Toldjah's (linking to her condemnations of Ann Coulter). Google "Glenn Reynolds Trent Lott".
The left enjoys no near-monopoly on virtue, nor the right on vice. Get over yourself.
Poor Glenn Greenwald. Right Blogostan is beside themselves claiming that the foaming hysteric just doesn’t understand Misha’s “hyperbole” and that people like Greenwald just don’t have a sense of humor. How can mere hyperbole hurt anyone? Has it ever hurt anyone?
ReplyDeleteReally, Glenn, get a grip.
In the meantime, while Glenn calms down, let’s listen to Iraq War Veteran, Shawn Stuart engage in a little hyperbole.
Not that there’s anything wrong with it.
Obviously, Shawn has a great sense of humor. Too bad Jews and blacks don’t. They never see the humor in “hyperbole” – that’s why you’ll never see a Jewish or black comedian – they’re all right-wing white Republicans.
anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteMaybe you should stay in the kiddie politics pool until you can keep up.
I think somebody took a big piss in the deep end because your "Altmouse" blog is getting rather stale. Is Altmouse a word you made up all by yourself or did you have help with this one? Is it supposed to be some kind of hardcore insult? Do you actually believe that more than fifty people have any idea what an "Altmouse" is?
Since you obviously see this as an entry into the adult world of politics, I will ask one more time. What the hell is an "Altmouse?" Now, if you think that keeping the definition of your clubhouse password a secret is an important part of the physical and psychological ritual that is "The Initiation", then is the answer revealed before or after the "Hall of Paddles" and "The Holy Measuring and Rubberband Game"?
You are the one who thinks American politics is a delicate affair like an afternoon tea party on the veranda.
Yeah, I am a real delicate flower. Just ask your mom.
Hence your confusion between the "reach around" and testicle measurement.
I will leave the distinction between a reach around and a testicle measurement to you, but donning a white coat and stethoscope during the "Rubberband Game" doesn't really make you a Doctor.
It's a tea party, alright, but more like the one they had that night in Boston harbor in 1773.
Let me guess. The password is "Altmouse." Do I need to bring my own wig?
I am definitely going out and getting grow a brian t-shirts made up. Cafe Press...
ReplyDeleteAs comedy, the Major is sublime.
ReplyDeleteIs this you?:
http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/images/blpic-moran.htm
sigh.......
ReplyDeletehttp://althouse.blogspot.com/
On Blogger Since January 2004
http://altmouse.blogspot.com/
On Blogger Since December 2005
I've heard them called willies, johnsons and dicks before; brian is a new one.
ReplyDeleteThe major's been away for a while. Maybe he's stroking his brian.
You want examples of prominent lefty opinionistas saying something as deranged as what Misha said? Check out the complete works of Ted Rall. Check out Markos "Screw Them" Zuniga.
ReplyDeleteGimme a break, buddy. Show me where Rall or Markos has suggested murder and then we'll talk - until then you've got no idea what you're talking about.
Yankeependragon
ReplyDeleteAll the accusations by the left and the right are an effort to discredit each other. In the larger sense, they are an effort to gain support for whichever side a person is sympathetic to, in other words votes.
The point is that our elected leaders are weak vessels, more concerned about their own selfish aims and aspirations than the people whose votes they wish to acquire.
All this combat in the blogosphere doesn't change the fact that the end result of the elections is someone in office that is essentially a parasite - a non-producer, who advanced whatever platitudes he/she thought the voters wanted to hear. We, the American people have let this happen.
Whatever the eventual answer may be, a person can at least gain some satisfaction that they are not paying for this underperformance. Another person may say " I don't like where this administration is taking us", same thing, at least I am not paying for it.
In sum, politics and government is one big losing game that supports a huge industry, enriches many, but does little for the individual.
Let me ask you: watching these mutts in action, do you feel like they should be given a freaking dime to watch over?
From michael: "Which is why they get so impatient with folks who insist on 'tying the president's hands' by requiring him to follow constitutional procedures."
ReplyDeleteWhy a king? And why a king now?
Rob
Ah I found the deleted comment (and it was a different case law than my recollection of FISA.) But This is what Ole Jeff found SOOooo offensive that it HAD to be deleted from his site:
ReplyDelete"Well - as to My comment posted to "Protein Wisdom" about various commentators at that blog with bits of *mis-reading* (mis-stating) of the regulations and case law. This has to do with these two operative issues:
**The Capitol Police regulations (as recited in Bynum).
**The case law holding in Bynum v. The United States Capital Police.
These are:
"...the United States Capitol Police Board issued a regulation that interprets “demonstration activity” to include:
“parading, picketing, speechmaking, holding vigils, sit-ins, or other expressive conduct that convey[s] a message supporting or opposing a point of view or has the intent, effect or propensity to attract a crowd of onlookers, but does not include merely wearing Tee shirts, buttons or other similar articles of apparel that convey a message.”
and the case ruling that:
"...the Capitol Police are enjoined from restricting any acts that they believe constitute “expressive conduct that convey[s] a message supporting or opposing a point of view or has the . . . propensity to attract a crowd of onlookers.."
While the Capitol Police Chief Terrance Gainer said in a statement late Wednesday:
“The officers made a good faith, but mistaken effort to enforce an old unwritten interpretation of the prohibitions about demonstrating in the Capitol...The policy and procedures were too vague...The failure to adequately prepare the officers is mine.”
The Capitol Police are PRESUMED to KNOW their own Guidelines and Regulations - and the CASE LAW rulings specifically involving "The Capitol Police" as a Defendant.
To pretend this *too vague to understand* and and was *unwritten* is Shameful! And Incorrect as a matter of pure FACT.
Or that this represented a *good faith* effort on the part of the officers to violate their OWN Departmental Guidlines IS not a definition of "good faith" exercise of their duties and powers to me.
And as the Judge stated, his ruling was to prevent "confer[ing] on the police a virtually unrestrained power to arrest and charge persons with a violation” and “the opportunity for abuse . . .[which] is self-evident.”
Hmm...given that study that showed insecure childen grow up to be Conservatives...ya think Jeff was a thumb-sucking whiners as a toddler? Might explain his *Thin Skin* And Political leanings.
*snark*
You guys (bloggers) take yourselves way to seriously.
ReplyDeleteThe Frisch thing is weird. From what I've read, she made some weird comments, probably in a "fit of stupidity." Then got trapped by them. Figure she should resign as the "right" thing to avoid embarrassment, then realized afterward that every employer for the rest of time will see this as a "Don't Hire This Goof" flag in her resume and has been backpedalling ever since. I suggest that she go back and ask for her resignation back and submit to some sort of period of probation and get her professional life back on track.
This Frisch thing seems to have ignited some intellectual undergrowth that (I guess) needs to be burnt off in order to avoid a bigger forest fire. Misha seems to have been the next to get caught in the flames.
1. The political and media establishment doesn't care about the right-wing blogosphere.
2. The right-wing is able to get anything it wants into the national news media Chris Bowers - MyDD
Yes, #1 and #2 seem to contradict each other, but there is a nuance to it.
Chris is right about #1, but hasn't quite realized that they don't really care about the "netroots" folks either. They only care that they might be able to mobilize some cheap-to-free labor for their campaigns. Meanwhile to this end, they are hoping that they can buy the services of (for instance) the followers of Kos, by buying Kos. This is the "Jesse Jackson" approach to politics, only Jesee (and few close advisors) get the money. I don't expect this to work past the 2008 election when a large portion of the "netroots" folks will go away disillusioned with politics forever (McGovernites all over again), even if they win.
aj beat me to it. Grow a brian is the Major's finest moment.
ReplyDeleteNot to mention he has honed his craft to such a fine point that sometimes one is even tempted to think he is not being humorous which just shows how good he has become at it.
But "Grow a brian" has to be the three best words written in the history of the blogosphere.
yankeependragon said...
From anonymous at 3:36pm:
I think Bob may have the right idea.
Nice advert for entrepenuership.
What's wrong with an advertisement for entrepeneurship? You think everyone enjoys all the advertisements for socialism?
His point was obvious. Protesting injustice and holding one's government accountable are marks of patriotism.
Funding either political party or any particular candidate (from the slate always running) is an exercise in futility, delusion and wishful thinking.
I'd fund someone different who actually had principles (like Glenn or PCR or Justin) but that's about it.
nuf said sez:
ReplyDeleteSpeaking of Dan Rather being a lyre, by what scale do you measure BoyGeorge to be truthful? The drumbeat to war was a bassless vitrola.
That would be "Victrola", I think.
Cheers,
Neo said...
ReplyDeleteYou guys (bloggers) take yourselves way to seriously.
Don't let the door hit you in yer face on the way out.
He's the 42nd most linked-to blogger on the Internet, and he is in the blogroll of scores of right-wing bloggers, such as Michelle Malkin and Captian's Quarters Blog.
ReplyDeleteIsn't someone missing from your list there? Somone like...Instapundit? Misha's been on Insty's blogroll for years and this is hardly the first awful thing he's said. I'm particulary fond of his thinly veiled racial slurs. For example, "sand nigger" becomes "sand ape" and "towelhead" becomes "sheethead". Brilliant.
The Major said...
ReplyDelete"And I don't appreciate people twisting my words in there context. What Randy Rhodes said doesn't count as a joke about a public figure because George W. Bush is the PRESIDENT OF THE UNTITED STATES.
Yoiu can't joke about assassinating the president of the United States. Ever. It's not funny it's incitment to kill our commander in chief in a time of war so it's no joke to me and I hope it's no joke to you either.
The Major said...
I gusee you just don't get it.
Making a joke about hanging up some supremem court justices is only a joke. Misha was just making a joke. "Some assembely required" Get it? It's like what you see sometimes when you buy things and it says "some assembely required" That's the joke."
I see, so it's ok to joke about hanging sitting Supreme Court Justices but not ok to joke about assassinating a sitting President.
Your mastery of the logical thought process is as impressive as ever "major"
I'm sure you will win over many to your side with such rare insight. I would sincerely urge you to continue posting such bits of wisdom unmatched by anyone else that posts here.
BTW have you given any more thought to volunteering to go to Iraq and actually earning the title of Major?
vermontraccoon said...
ReplyDeleteShit! All this time I thiught GWOT stood for "GOP's War on Truth".......
It does, It does!! :-)
eyes wide open said...
ReplyDeleteNot to mention he has honed his craft to such a fine point that sometimes one is even tempted to think he is not being humorous which just shows how good he has become at it. But "Grow a brian" has to be the three best words written in the history of the blogosphere.
I agree completely. Anyone not enjoying the Major show is really missing out. I suspect it is a somewhat familiar face to this blog, who is just enjoying the weather.
anonymous said...
What a tool! Why not fuck off now, before you embarass yourself further.
Now we are getting somewhere. I have got a box of rubberbands, will you just repeat what you said five times slowly, but like this---
You need to linger on and draw out the words "tool" and "fuck". You also need to say embarrass, like this, em-bar-ass, stopping after each syllable.
That's it.
I have three browser windows open. One with Kos. One with Red State. One with Staples.com.
I am ready to go when you are. Oh and say hi to conrad's ghost for me.
The Major said:
ReplyDeleteYoiu can't joke about assassinating the president of the United States.
Here's the joke: "The Major" plays dumb-as-a-doornail, and then spells "assassinating" correctly. He stepped out of character. That should have been sumptin' like "assinating" if he was really on his toes. HTH. ;-)
Cheers,
What happened? They all seemed to find such disturbing rhetoric so upsetting, such cause for great alarm this weekend, when it came from an obscure person in some comment section, but they have not said a word of condemnation about these death calls from a prominent blogger on the Right. Nor have any of them condemned the calls by Misha's readers for Islamic countries to be turned into radioactive parking lots or for the death of the towel heads by other means. Why not?
ReplyDelete---
Uh, because they're really stupid hypocrites?
Deb
Confederate Yankee's hypothesis that Deb Frisch is emblematic of the entire left was outrageous and contemptible.
ReplyDelete====
Uh, actually it was just stupid and hypocritical (see above). Most lefties, including my friends and family and the moonbats I associate with here in YOU JEAN ORRY GONE condemn my JonBenet/Satchel joke.
For the rightwing nutcases to try to use my bad judgment in Count Cockula's cesspool as some sort of symptom about academics or liberals or liberal academics IN GENERAL is nuttier than a Snickers bar.
The new low is how blackfive put out the call to arms about me saying I wouldn't care if Count Cockula's kid was Ramseyed.
ReplyDeleteCalling all anklebiters!!!! Contact the dyke moonbat’s boss and let's teach teach cindysheehanwardchurchilldenicedenton a lesson she won’t forget!
Ace of spades wouldn't do this kind of sh**. Villanous Company wouldn't even join the feeding frenzy (50 trakbaks to nail a moonbat!).
As the story unfolds, the details about Count Cockula's second experience of baiting a troll into talking about Satchel will fade (She did SO say the Auntie Moonbat Saliva thing!!!) and the story will be about how crazy the rightwing blogosphere is.
This isn't going to be on Fux News (I was asked to be interviewed by John Gibson, but I declined) it's going to be on Comedy Central. Colbert Report, I'm hoping.
DF
Scott said...
ReplyDeleteI think both sides ..right and left are rushing way too fast towards the edge. Yes the extremes on both sides are acting way too extreme, but I also believe both sides are expecting toomuch for the other. Deb is sounding pretty sick but so is Misha... Can't we accept that as kinda a quid pro quo?
So your saying that it's ok for one side to call for the hanging of Supreme court judges as long as it's balanced out by the other side calling for the assassination of the president?
I think you should reread that very carefully and look closely at what you are advocating.
Par for the course for the extreme right-wing blogosphere. Soon we will hbear how Deb Frisch is somehow connected to Bill Clinton. Mustn't foget to blame Clinton for everything!
ReplyDeleteDeb is sounding pretty sick but so is Misha... Can't we accept that as kinda a quid pro quo?
ReplyDelete---
I think it would be really helpful for public debate for both sides to identify their wacko extremists. 99.9% of moonbats I know want to distance themselves from my jonbenet comment. Most moonbats I know would endorse the substantive things on my blog -the bush bashing, kooky kristian bashing, lindsey gayham mocking, etc. 50% of democrats would distance themselves from me.
Separating the moonbats from the democrats and the wingnuts from the republicans would be good.
And looking at the worst produced by each might provide a clue about which side is most pathological. Is one comment by a moonbat trolling really worse than the drivel produced by O'ReillyLimbaugh and all the third rate rabid rightwing bloggers like Goldstein?
Deb
BTW, Cervantes, you may not have heard of me, but I've written about you. I thought we had some email contact after this post, but maybe not.
http://debfrisch.com/archives/2005/11/blog_after_my_o.html