Wednesday, December 14, 2005

The true character of the European Left

My recent reference to Rep. Cynthia McKinney as a genuine “hater of America” sparked a dispute in my Comments section -- as well as on the far-left, oh-so-cleverly named Smirking Chimp site -- as to what constitutes “anti-Americanism.” Clearly, mere criticism of the American Government or even the U.S. generally is not sufficient to merit that term. Something further is required, which I defined this way:

If "anti-American" means anything, I'd say it means an inclination to blame America for every world problem, and to vigilantly search for America's guilt while downplaying, ignoring, or excusing the guilt of its enemies.


Whatever the proper definition of the term “anti-American” is, it exists in grotesque abundance throughout the European Left. It was difficult to read yesterday’s Associated Press article reporting on the so-called “outrage” among “Europeans” towards Arnold Schwarzengger’s refusal to grant clemency to mass murderer Tookie Williams without feeling a good amount of outrage of one's own.

It goes without saying that the self-righteousness and unwarranted pomposity oozes out of every paragraph. But far worse is the malignant and uncontrollable compulsion to exploit liberal principles of human rights and individual liberty as cynical weapons devoted to their Real Cause of attacking the U.S. whenever the opportunity presents itself:

The execution of convicted killer Stanley Tookie Williams sparked outrage Tuesday throughout Europe, which has a deep aversion to capital punishment sustained by the painful memory of state-organized murder during the Nazi era.

The disappointment was particularly strong in Austria, native country of Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger, where many had hoped the former bodybuilder and film star would spare the 51-year-old Williams.

Leaders of Austria's opposition Green Party even called for Schwarzenegger to be stripped of his Austrian citizenship - a demand rejected by Chancellor.


And it isn’t that they merely oppose Tookie Williams’ execution and see it as some sort of profound and unique human rights violation. Some of them actually believe that the gentle, peace-loving mass murderer Williams is morally superior to Gov. Schwarzenneger as a result of this execution:


In Graz, Schwarzenegger's hometown, local Greens said they would file a petition to remove the California governor's name from the city's Arnold Schwarzenegger Stadium. A Christian political group suggested it be renamed for Williams.

"Mr. Williams had converted and, unlike Mr. Schwarzenegger, opposed every form of violence,"
said Richard Schadauer, chairman of the Association of Christianity and Social Democracy.

The moral perversion here is breathtaking. Convicted multiple murderer Tookie Williams is now the hero of the European Left in whose honor they want to re-name monuments. And it is Gov. Schwarzenegger who is the criminal and murderer who deserves punishment and public repudiation.

And this is where the odious anti-Americanism is so evident. Say what you will about the death penalty – reasonable people can certainly disagree about it, and it’s one of the issues to which I confess an irresolvable ambivalence, usually leaning against it. But even to ardent death penalty opponents, the execution of the unquestionably guilty mass murderer and violent gang founder Tookie Williams –- after a jury trial and multiple judicial appeals –- ranks very, very low on the list of the world’s human rights outrages and grave injustices.

The countries which the European Left makes a passionate cause of defending – from the Palestinian Authority to Iran and Syria, not to mention Cuba, China and multiple other historic Communist regimes –- routinely imprison and/or execute people without any due process, for reasons ranging from criticism of the Government to adultery and homosexuality. None of that sparks “outrage among Europeans,” because none of that provides an opportunity to depict the United States as the world’s real evil. As a result, the European Left is uninterested in it.

And therein lies the embodiment and definition of “anti-Americanism”: the parmaount desire to find fault and evil with the U.S. and thereby adopting that goal as the first and only real principle, from which everything else follows. That goal is then fulfilled by selectively and endlessly highlighting and exaggerating America’s faults and downplaying, ignoring and even defending far worse flaws in others. In its most virulent (and quite common) form, this extends to making common cause with the most abusive and genuinely evil regimes and movements around the world, whose only virtue –- the only one the European Left needs -- is that they are opposed by the U.S.

This is a deeply dishonest and manipulative syndrome, having nothing whatever to do with the principles to which its adherents claim fidelity. Indeed, their supposed “principles” (human rights, the sanctity of human life, individual liberty) are simply weapons, pretexts, used to promote the only real principle they have – that the U.S. is a uniquely corrupt and evil country. And the reason one knows that to be the case is because these same individuals systematically overlook and even excuse far more severe violations of their ostensible principles when perpetrated by the countries and governments with which they inexcusably sympathize (sympathy which itself can be explained by a desire to sit in opposition to any and every American interest).

Right under the noses of the European Left, European Muslim extremists – whom the European Left instinctively defends -- have been systematically executing scores of people for the last several years: innocent people, not mass murderers, who have been randomly slaughtered, without any due process or judicial appeals of any kind. They murder film makers and journalists and they blow up hotels, synagogues, and European mass transit systems. Where is the “outrage” over these incidents from the European Left, which (unlike the murderous United States) cares oh-so-much about principles of non-violence, human rights and the sanctity of life?

And the Middle Eastern countries with which the European Left has made common cause, beginning with the Palestinians and then extending to most other Arab countries in that region, routinely violate the principles which the European Left pretends to believe in, with scarcely a peep of protest from them. It is not Palestianian and Iranian executions of homosexuals or the Chinese imprisonment of dissidents which moves them to “outrage.” It is only the act of Arnold Schwarzenegger in refusing to overturn the decision of a jury upheld after multiple appeals to execute a mass murderer which does so, because that enables them to highlight America’s evil.

And that brings us to the worst part of the article – the part where, as usual, we hear that the views of the European Left are entitled to a presumption of rightness and moral wisdom because . . . . the Holocaust happened in Europe:


Six decades after World War II, opposition to the death penalty remains deeply entrenched in Germany and Austria, a stance resulting from remorse for the evils committed by these countries under Adolf Hitler and an attempt to prevent future state-sponsored killing.


This quite common theme – that the Europeans now possess some sort of enhanced historical and moral wisdom because the Holocaust happened on their continent, under their noses and/or those of their immediate ancestors – is really one of the more illogical and disgusting pieties used by the European Left and their allies to advance their agenda.

Somehow, Europeans have managed to transform the atrocities which they committed and which occurred in their countries from a badge of shame (which, arguably, it need not be any longer) into some sort of badge of moral superiority and entitlement to sit in judgment of others as the Universal Arbiters of Goodness (which it most certainly is not). While there is an argument to be made that things like the Holocaust (not to mention the two world wars spawned by European countries in Europe) should no longer be used to suggest that the Europeans have an inherent propensity towards violence and savagery, those historical events certainly cannot be used, as Europeans and their worshipers try to do, to prove the opposite – namely, that Europe is somehow now the central repository for moral wisdom and universal human rights such that they have some unique ability to decree what is and is not just.

And if, as this Associated Press article suggests, the European Left sees the Holocaust -- which happens to be notable for its systematic slaughter of innocent people -- as being even remotely equivalent to the execution of a mass murderer after abundant due process, then it only illustrates just how perverse it is to believe that those on the European Left are now the moral proprieters of the Holocaust and other European atrocities, entitled to wield those events as proof of their experience-based superior moral wisdom. The Holocaust did not happen to the European Left. At best, they are neutral observers of it, and in reality, are by-products of the societies and historical roots which produced it. Listening to the European Left try to use the 20th Century European atrocities to bolster their self-anointed status as human rights guardians is as nonsensical as it is offensive.

It is moments like these when the European Left gets exposed for the unprincipled, hollow, nakedly hypocritical world-view which drives it. They recruit and cynically exploit precepts of human rights, individual liberty, and even the Holocaust, all to serve their cause of attacking the United States. And they do grave harm to the principles which they claim to believe in by distorting them in service of an entirely different agenda.

I hope the leftist parties in Austria and around Europe succeed in re-naming their monuments after Tookie Williams. That way, everyone will be able to clearly see exactly the attributes which are exalted by those who deceitfully parade themselves around as the world's Guardians of Universal Human Rights.

105 comments:

  1. Anonymous8:58 AM

    Glenn, I have to say I'm disappointed with this post. There may be some things wrong with liberals in Europe, nobody is perfect, but compared to the Bush Administration, why spend your talents swatting at flies when there are real monsters on the loose? I honestly don't understand this.

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  2. Anonymous9:11 AM

    I have to agree with Diane. What's the point of doing this? Whatever upset you have with the Europeans, doesn't it pale in comparison to the havoc which the Bush administration is wreaking and which you often document?

    And why shouldn't liberals attacks the Terminator for terminating another life? Murder doesn't become moral just because the U.S. government does it.

    And your cynacism about the European experience with the holocaust is appalling. Of course they are more sensitive to human rights abuses and state-sanctioned murder, having lived through it. Why can't we accept that other people do have insight and moral wisdom that we lack? Talk about a character flaw.

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  3. That is exactly the kind of thinking which I can't stand - and frequently criticize - when it comes (as it often does) from the Right, and I find it not one iota more appealing when it’s found on the Left.

    This notion that anybody who is "on your side" with regard to some specific issue(s) ought to be - for that reason alone - immune from criticism no matter their sins and excesses is one of the more corrupt and destructive beliefs floating around. It produces all sorts of unholy alliances and overlooked evils.

    The way I see it, nothing does greater injury to particular principles than those who pretend to believe in those principles but who are actually exploiting them for unrelated agendas. That's why I can't stomach huge swaths of the European Left -- they are fundamentally dishonest and deceitful about what they really are interested in achieving. Why would anyone who genuinely believes in those principles -- possibly want to align themselves with a movement like that?

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  4. Anonymous11:03 AM

    Outrageous, Glenn. The Left in Europe IS committed to human rights, which is why they are against the slaughter of people. How dare you question their sincerity and motives that way.

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  5. Amen, Glenn! Please continue to tell it like it is no matter whose feathers get ruffled.

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  6. Anonymous11:17 AM

    Amanda --

    How dare he question their sincerity and motives?

    Easy.

    Bosnia-Herzegovina.

    Jesus, don't you READ? EVER?

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  7. Anonymous11:19 AM

    On the subject of anti-americanism, ala Mckinney, I also believe a lesser evil, much more prevalent today, is to be "un-american". Take Howard Dean's comments re: Iraq. It's not "anti-american" to say what he said, he's not a traitor. He's pessimistic, which is his wont. But!! His attitude, "we are losing, we cannot win, the thousands of insurgents with no real technology save cellphones and laptops have bested umpteen trillion dollars of military research and training, we have no friends, our soldiers suck" is un-american. It's un-american in the sense that, if Roosevelt heard it, Lincoln heard it, Kennedy heard it, Patton heard it, or any other general, president, or leader from any other american generation heard it, they'd slap Dean on the head with a glove like patton did to that soldier in the sick bay and chase them out screaming "you goddamn coward!!!!" because Americans believe they can win, period. To say otherwise is to be un-american.

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  8. Glenn,

    You heard Amanda and her friends. How dare you criticize hypocrisy when it goes against naked political interest?!

    Outstanding analysis, precisely correct, and morally whole.

    It's too bad some of your readers can't set aside their own hatred and animosity and actually consider the reason and logic behind what you say.

    My guess is that they will need to experience the horror of 9/11 (or another holocaust) before it migth sink in.

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  9. I've been saying the same for a long time, Glenn. You've said it better than I could.

    You should know that the average European is not as anti-death penalty as the European media would like you to believe. In many European countries, the majority are for the death penalty when it comes to heinous crimes. The majority of citizens in both the UK and Canada believe the option should be available as a sentence.

    In these countries where the death penalty was banned, were citizens given the option to vote on it? Nope.

    The European left says nothing about the thousands of political prisoners executed in China. Zero, zip, nada. Until they generate at least the same amount of faux moral outrage over the true evil regimes in the world, their phony protests mean nothing to me.

    We certainly have problems with our process. I think it's absurd that some states do not have true "life without parole" options.

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  10. Comments disgusting, post excellent.

    "Glenn, I have to say I'm disappointed with this post. There may be some things wrong with liberals in Europe, nobody is perfect, but compared to the Bush Administration, why spend your talents swatting at flies when there are real monsters on the loose?"

    The first step is realizing that the socialists and post-modern Communists in the European Left aren't "liberals," and they hate the United States with every bone in their body, Democrat and Republican.

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  11. Anonymous11:38 AM

    Euro aversion to capital punishment was NOT born after WWII, no matter what they now say. After their liberation every single country in the formerly-occupied Europe held mass trials in which many of the most prominent traitors, collaborators and war criminals were tried and executed. This includes even those countries that are now most prominent for their self-righteous anti-Americanism - Belgium, Norway, Italy, Holland etc. In France alone some 10,000 people were executed in judicial and extra-judicial killings. Only after that was there a genuine anti-capital punishment movement.

    Martin Adamson

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  12. Glenn,
    You are right on target. My first disenchantment with this tendency for the Europeans' intellectual dishonesty goes back to the anti-americanism seen with the deployment of US missiles in Western Europe in response to the Soviet's deployment of the SS-20 in Eastern Europe. The Left (Greens strong among them) then was able to drum up great public anti-american support while ignoring the missiles on the other side. How many peace camps were there outside of Soviet missile bases? One guess.

    Sad, but it's been said that the Left no longer has any real principles, only positions. I would add that if an issue has an "anti-american position" (or an anti-Bush position for American Democrats), then that's where you will find the modern Left, regardless of the moral or intellectual hollowness of that position.

    Keep up the good work.

    Leonid

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  13. More on pro-death penalty sentiment in Europe:

    http://www.rasmusen.org/x/archives/652

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  14. Anonymous11:42 AM

    Thanks Glenn,

    Great points. Good definition of anti-American, too.

    Some comments above missed your point entirely.

    Amanda says "How dare you question..."

    That is exactly the kind of thinking that allows and fosters things like the Holocaust.

    Right now in this country the the shortcut to totalitarianism is on the left because of this kind of self-righteousness and narrow-mindedness.

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  15. Anonymous11:44 AM

    I gather from some of these comments that you have left the impression at some point that you buy into the sorehead left's position that whatever crimes are committed in the world pale in comparison to those of ChimpBu$hHitler and his jackbooted $torm troopers. The martyrdom of Tookie is just another example. And his son who dwells in a prison isolation cell for persistent disciplinary infractions -- what about this son convicted of second degree murder? When will Europe wake up to that injustice? Free all political prisoners . . . hell, free all prisoners.

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  16. Anonymous11:48 AM

    ...and what's often missed in these articles that talk about how "deeply entrenched" European opposition to the death penalty is this: when the general European public is polled about the death penalty (as opposed to assertions by the political/university classes), the results are much more ambivalent -- the public's support for the death penalty is usually at least 40% and very often 50%+! These polls are out there -- google is your friend!

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  17. Anonymous12:01 PM

    I think there's something to be said about devoting your energy to where it's most useful. Did it ever occur to you that perhaps European liberals think they'll be able to change the mind of the leader of another Western nation, like the US, than trying to change the mind of a psychopath like Hu Jintao? (a man whose regime is better defended and coddled by your own government than most European ones, by the way)

    There's also the small matter of the US being, as y'all so like to put it, "The world's only superpower." If you can't deal with the criticism, then give France tons of money until they become the superpower, and everyone will attack them. Until then, you're supposedly the standard other countries should strive for. You are held up to a higher standard than any other country because of your superpower status.. this immediately opens the US up to more criticism.

    By the way, I'm sick of the cross Americans constantly put themselves on with this ridiculous notion that the entire continent of Europe hates you. It really makes you look whiny and self-centered. Try coming here someday.

    Peace out,
    Anonymous Icelander

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  18. Anonymous12:01 PM

    It will be interesting to watch all these people's reactions when the executions of John William King and Lawrence Russell Brewer, the pickup dragging lynchers, come due.

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  19. Anonymous12:10 PM

    To all of the wingnuts congregating here today like flies - the point (which you're missing) here is that there is nothing wrong with being opposed to the death penalty. And it's just absolutely sick to suggest, as Glenn very disappointingly has, that there's something wrong with Europeans having taking the lessons of the Holocaust to heart.

    It may be that they had a long history of violence before 1945, but they have obviously learned from it, and we haven't. That why we have so much violence and why we love to kill, and they are opposed to it.

    They learned from their history that violence doesn't work, and we should listen to it, not mock it.

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  20. Anonymous12:13 PM

    Parfait!
    The only thing left out of the discussion is WHY the Euro Left hates the US so, viz: As the greatest and most successful capitalist nation the world has ever seen, the nihilistic Left detests the US more than anything else and wants to see that greatness destroyed and brought low. One European called it by its true name: Ressentiment. Nietzsche found as most vile the emotional trait of envy, resentment and revenge that "festers in the weak, prompting them to seek vengeance against the strong, the noble, and the talented."

    Years ago I started and later abandonded a Blog called "American Street" -- a sort of reverse of all the talk about the "Arab Street" rising up, revolting, etc etc etc. I've had it with the blatant Anti-Americanism out there (and here). Its not a perfect place, but in so many ways better than those places in which AntiAmericanism thrives (Compare the fairly integrated culture here in NY and in much of the US with the isolated ghettos of the French banlieues). Not going to take it any more.

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  21. Anonymous12:16 PM

    "That why we [Americans] have so much violence and why we love to kill, and they[Europeans] are opposed to it."

    Funny how America is always described as fascist, but yet fascism actually appears so often in Europe?

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  22. Anonymous12:18 PM

    Lefties couldn't run Europe if they didn't have electoral systems that give pluralities powers that in the US would be considered dictatorial.

    Is that like how the Democratic minority (44 seats) in the Senate actually represents 52% of the voters, or more like how somebody can become president even when the other guy got more votes? 'cuz I'm confused.

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  23. I agree with the post above. I went to South Africa a year or two ago, and conversations that turned to politics always had to be prefaced with 2 or 3 minutes of "Americans are stupid/boorish/ignorant" "Americans dont care about Africa" "Americans are bullies of the world" diatribe before they got down to the real gist of the conversation. And of course, they rarely failed to mention that they were saving up money to move to America as soon as they could.

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  24. Anonymous12:43 PM

    Glenn could not be more accurate in his analysis. The left in both Europe and the U.S. has long had a sickening romance with violent criminals. The New Left of the 60s and 70s hosted posh parties for the Black Panthers, notwithstanding that Huey Newton et al. were murderers and criminals to their bones. Indeed, when the CA Panthers executed their white bookkeeper, Betty van Patter, and then shot their former attorney, Faye Stender (who would not cooperate in an attempted prison break), in a crucifixion pattern 5 times, leaving her paralyzed but alive -- the movement had nothing to say, and certainly no denunciations of the Panthers. Stender fled to Japan and ultimately committed suicide.

    The left kept silent about these murders by their paragons of revolutionary virtue, because, as Panther fan and French author Jean Genet put it, the Panthers were "Red Blacks." Genet, like many on the Euro-left than and now, hate the U.S. and thought the Panthers were the vanguard of the revolution. These criminals could commit no sin that rivaled the Evil U.S., and the less said about their little mistakes, the better.

    It was the murders of van Patter and Stender that caused David Horowtiz and Peter Collier to leave the left and look at it with the rose-colored glasses removed. They were not alone, and this violence inherent in leftist ideology is why so many, for nearly a century, have made a trek out of left-wing enclaves. The idea that the left stands in a position of moral authority to criticize the U.S. on human rights grounds, is, quite literally, preposterous.

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  25. Anonymous12:44 PM

    Glenn,

    Excellent definition of Anti-American. I also appreciate the stunning examples of it in your comments. It really does provide a quick study.

    Oh, Adrianne Truett, great wit!

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  26. Anonymous12:44 PM

    If Europe has learned so much from the Holocaust, why did they create new death camps in the Balkans in the 1990s? If the Europeans have ascended to a loftier moral plain as a consequence of their engagement with the Holocaust, why did they allow 8000 Bosniaks to be slaughtered by the Serb Army at Srebrenica in 1995? The Dutch troops supposedly guarding the victims helped load them on the buses to their deaths with perfect knowledge of what they were doing. Where was that European moral superiority when the Bosniaks were being loaded onto the death buses?

    It was American troops which put an end to the new European ethnic cleansing, just as we ended the European Holocaust a couple generations ago. It is American troops camped in Europe which stops the Europeans from descending, once again, into savage tribal warfare with high tech weapons.

    It is the height of irony that the Europeans claim a superior morality when only American force of arms stops them from chucking each other into ovens or mass graves.

    Tantor

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  27. Anonymous12:51 PM

    Here is more on France's Lucid Leaders Knowing Whom to Castigate and Whose Sensibilities to Manage

    Here is more on Germany's lessons from the Third Reich (free and independent journalists, objectivity as total as possible, etc)…

    Here is more on Europe's undying commitment to ban the death penalty...

    Here is more on Europe's principles in international relations

    Glenn Greenwald's detractors claim that anti-Americanism is at best non-existent and at worst exaggerrated, referring to the tired old canard that "it is only our leaders they are against". Really? Is that so?

    Tell me, how often have the Europeans commented on the disdain they have for, say, the leaders and/or administrations of Russia, China, Cuba, Zimbabwe, Iran, and (Saddam's) Iraq, and that with the same vehemence they reserve for Uncle Sam?

    How often have they held mass demonstrations against the fighting in Chechnya, the conflict between Ethiopie and Eritrea, and the Iran-Iraq war?

    How often have they held vigils against the death penalty in China, in Saudi Arabia, or in Sudan, and when did they ever express "concern" over how prisoners in those countries were treated?

    Those Frenchmen who stated proudly "Chirac had the balls to stand up to Bush", how did they react when their president said that France would not mention human rights during a visit to the Kremlin because it was necessary "to show consideration for Russian sensibilities"?

    How did those humanists react when Paris lit the Eiffel Tower in red for the visit of the Chinese president, when the government banned Nobel laureate Gao Xingjian from attending the Paris Book Fair, or when Chirac, along with fellow peace-lover Gerhard Schröder, tried to resume selling weapons to the saber-rattlers of Beijing?

    There was not much of a reaction, was there?

    The truth is, the Europeans didn't (and don't) care. They didn't care one way or the other for one simple reason: they were issues in which Uncle Sam was not involved.

    Anti-Americanism is quite alive: it is the practice, on a regular basis, of double standards. Nothing more. And nothing less.

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  28. Anonymous12:52 PM

    Anonymous wrote:

    "Is that like how the Democratic minority (44 seats) in the Senate actually represents 52% of the voters, or more like how somebody can become president even when the other guy got more votes? 'cuz I'm confused."

    Or how the granularity of Senate seats means the the Democrats are overrepresented, because the House with smaller districts is predominantly Republican ;^)

    You pissant.

    Yours, TDP, ml, msl, & pfpp

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  29. Anonymous12:54 PM

    It's incredible that so many Europeans so willfully neglect one of the paramount lessons of WW II, that of the betrayal of Czechoslovakia at Munich, for the sake of "peace in our time". The mistake was repeated again in the 1990's when European governments were unable to confront the Milosovic regime, and ethnic cleansing and concentration camps in the former Yugoslavia - until the Americans showed up. Fortunately, generations of Americans and many Europeans, too, have understood that that totalitarian regimes must be confronted, not appeased, before it is too late.

    I live in the Czech Republic right on the former Iron Curtain, which was the Berlin Wall stretched all across Europe, built to keep people living under an evil system from running away to the lands of freedom and justice. A few weeks ago I went with a group of Czechs to Auschwitz. I must admit I was pretty stunned to hear one of them cursing the damn imperialists; another put Auschwitz in the context of "Bush's war". I suppose the logic is this: under Communist ideology, WW II was nothing more than a clash of capitalist imperialist systems. In some people's minds today, that makes America just as responsible for the Holocaust as the Nazis. So listen up, you Americans who think the Europeans are somehow wiser than Bubba - my guess is that it's the other way around. The Nazi and Communist ideologies aren't dead in Europe. Instead, they've been passed down, and underpin the phenomenon of modern anti-Americanism.

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  30. Anonymous12:57 PM

    Media thing: Do you mean like when the Times rambles on about how the socialized Scandinavian countries are a hair's breadth away from falling apart economically? Or do you mean when Fox News tells us that the French infrastructure is collapsing due to riots (which were found to be based more on economic inequality than anything else) similar to those experienced in 1960's Watts and 1990's South Central LA?

    Austria thing: You have a former KKK member as a Senator and your Senate majority leader was ousted for saying the country would be better off had a segregationist been elected president 50 years ago. Waldheim claimed he had been a lowly foot soldier (kinda like the pope), but further information came to light, which the Austrian government investigated. They found nothing conclusive, releasing a statement along the lines of "yea, he probably did horrible things." Horrible, yes, but it was also 15 years ago.. nothing current on your mind?

    Islamo thing: The UK police announced that they have stopped three terrorist attacks since 7/7.

    Kyoto thing: 95% of environmental research done in the US also says Kyoto is a good idea. We're hardly alone. Jobs mean nothing if your planet sucks, and your major coastal cities are flooded (and personally, Kyoto means less chance of Iceland becoming uninhabitable due to the Gulf Stream shutting down, so I think we have a damn good vested interest in the global warming debate).

    "Most of the problems in the world," eh? Nice blanket statement.

    Turkey thing: I would guess when Turkey joins the EU, which should be in the next few years.

    Swiss thing: In relation to the Swiss accounts, they're working on it with the help of Paul Volcker (oh noes! The UN!)

    Chirac's awful.. he's going to be arested on at least two counts of fraud when he steps down as president, but there was no other option.. you seem like you'd have been a Le Pen guy if you were French... that's not something to be proud of.

    Defence thing: There's 400 million of us and our forces are spread between many well-trained armies. Your army is better, but I think ours would do the trick if need be.

    So, when is the US going to do something about the tens of millions of children not getting healthcare?

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  31. Anonymous1:03 PM

    Oops! The third sentence in my post above should have been linked to a different URL address. The following is correct:

    Here is more on Europe's undying commitment to ban the death penalty...

    Sorry for the confusion...

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  32. Anonymous1:09 PM

    "95% of environmental research done in the US also says Kyoto is a good idea."

    Please enlighten me with some kind of link, and if you are serious, some explanation of which part of the link you think is especially telling. I call bullshit on the whole statement.


    "So, when is the US going to do something about the tens of millions of children not getting healthcare? "

    Really? Could you point me to a news story here? Or if you point me to some left-wing web page, kindly point out, or better yet, quote the part you think especially significant.

    I am sure that you won't respond because both statements are lies. Agitprop fed to you by your European media/govt duopoly.

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  33. Anonymous1:18 PM

    Excellent post, a model of compact ironclad argument. Jean-Francois Revel needed a whole book to make the same point. The naked purblind hypocrisy of some of the comments is also hilarious.

    Today’s Europeans are the descendants of reformed mass murders, or rather not reformed but unpunished (reformation is an unprovable quality – all murderers are reformed until they kill again). And because their crimes were not sufficiently punished the taint has passed to the current generation. The persistent European tendency to industrial scale slaughter is amply illustrated by their yawing indifference to the genocides in Bosnia and Kosovo. But they don’t wish to face their existential guilt. In their minds mere reform coupled with minor acts of contrition are sufficient to expiate any degree of guilt. So naturally they see in Tookie Williams a kindred soul -- a reformed killer, i.e. a killer who has not had the opportunity to kill lately, with a certifiable act of contrition in hand, a few semi-literate anti-violence screeds said to be children’s books. Voila! Tookie Williams, a social saint whose person is inviolate.

    Sincerely,
    Neal

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  34. Anonymous1:22 PM

    http://www.ahrq.gov/research/feb03/0203RA6.htm

    14% of American children are uninsured for health care.

    I reread my post and realized I mistyped.. 95% of research agrees that global warming exists, something about which the President says "the jury's still out"

    -Anon. Ice.

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  35. Anonymous1:36 PM

    And therein lies the embodiment and definition of “anti-Americanism”: the parmaount desire to find fault and evil with the U.S. and thereby adopting that goal as the first and only real principle, from which everything else follows. That goal is then fulfilled by selectively and endlessly highlighting and exaggerating America’s faults and downplaying, ignoring and even defending far worse flaws in others.

    Whew baby, have you missed the boat on this one, and worse -- the 13th toll of the clock bell, which calls into doubt the accuracy of everything which came before, as my favorite rhetorician likes to say . . .

    Look, here's what's going on with the European left -- see if you can recognize this phenomenon: It often occurs that right-minded people hold those with whom they most closely identify -- for example, with respect to the European democracies, America -- to a higher standard and expectation of conduct than those with whom they share no such identification -- China and Iran, for example. Thus, when you say in your comment "This notion that anybody who is "on your side" with regard to some specific issue(s) ought to be - for that reason alone - immune from criticism no matter their sins and excesses is one of the more corrupt and destructive beliefs floating around," you get it exactly backwards. What's behind the Europeans' outrage is the belief that the U.S. ought not to be "immune" from criticism, precisely because it is so clearly "on the Europeans' side" with respect to a very important "specific issue" -- in this case, an ostensibly deeply shared commitment to respect for human rights.

    Get it? It's pretty simple, and it's a pretty common psychological-political phenomenon. And in my opinion there's not a damn thing wrong with it. Personally, I do it all the time -- e.g., as a Jew, I hold Israel to a higher standard of political conduct than its Arab neighbors, regardless of how much I deplore those neighbors' own violations of civilized norms. (If that's an unhealthy attitude, by the way, it's not because I'm being "unfair to Israel" (any more than, as you so ridiculously suggest, the Europeans are being unfair to the United States and poor Arnold Schwarzenegger) -- it's because that attitude harbors within it a potentially racist/nationalist bias against the Arabs, not the Israelis, for which I need to take responsibility.) And, apart from all your dismay that the Europeans seem to expect more from the U.S. than from China, that's also why the Europeans exhibit more outrage at an intentional killing carried out at the behest of a well-heeled American political leader than they do at an intentional killing carried out by a fucked-up 22 year-old (or whatever he was at the time) from the Los Angeles ghetto.

    Is this really so difficult to understand? It strikes me as obvious. I'm astonished that you don't seem to get it at all, even to the extent of acknowledging a point of view that you may not agree with but which at least deserves some minimum modicum of respect (which, obviously, is entirely lacking from your post). And I'm revolted that the prime target for your anti-European spleen would be -- of all things! -- their revulsion at the death penalty. Sheesh. Amazing.

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  36. Anonymous1:44 PM

    I strongly disagree with Glen. Why ? Because I know the way Americans think. They try to find an excuse for their own failures, their excuse is "look how bad the Europeans are, we are better.

    Uhm... wait. This might lead to a classic 'did not - did too!' fight. Let's not go there, please?

    First of all, the 'rage' isn't that wide spread. It's an American issue, so if America thinks this is the best way to convince their black lower-class citizens that they should stay on the straigh-and-narrow, it's up to you guys.

    Yes, there is very limited support for the capital sentence in Europe. It is regarded as barbaric, since there is no way to obtain justice from the death of another human being. Justice is about healing, about rehabilitation, about restoring what's been damaged. Revenge is about 'you killed one of us, so we'll kill you'. That's the law of the street, that's the law of gangs - and that's what the death penalty is all about. Wasn't that exectly what you were trying to keep kids away from? I know, we've had the death penalty in Europe too. And every now and then, politicians (usually on the far right side) bring it up again. There's a strong correlation between economic prosperity and the number of people in favor of reinstating the death penalty: if people feel they're too low in Maslow's pyramid, they tend to obtain security by killing potential threats. That explains why the death penalty is often abolished a few years after a war, when stability returns.

    And now for something completely different.. from a logical point of view, from where I'm standing, I don't get it. Why execute a role-model of the black youngsters, who - agreed! - once did an awful terrible thing, but was converted and tried very hard to keep these kids on the straight-and-narrow? Where's the gain? Will his violent death be a clearer guide to these kids than his books? In my opinion, the only message that society is sending here in this death, is that there is no turning back ('if you're black', will the gangster recruiter add). No mercy, no matter what you do. How do you guys assess the risk that Williams will be idolized and used by negative forces in society to destabilize the black youth?

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  37. "Some comments above missed your point entirely."

    No, that doesn't go far enough. Actually, some of the comments above entirely illustrated his point.

    As for my impressions of European moral authority, Europe is doing nothing right now to convince me that another holocaust within thier borders is not a real possibility. Europe remains a very dark place. The comments by Europe's defenders in this thread only reinforce that impression.

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  38. Anonymous1:45 PM

    Peggy writes: If the European Left really believes in what they say they believe in, they will adopt a consistent standard without making excuses for some while wholly and automatically condemning others in knee jerk fashion.

    Well said. An example of a grotesquely inconsistent left -- in the U.S. and abroad -- was the reaction to the fatwa issued on the Western Marxist and writer, Salman Rushdie, for daring to draft a novel that was critical of Islam. The man had a huge bounty placed on his head for a speech crime, but many purported civil libertarians on the left blamed him for being insensitive and inflammatory.

    What if Rushdie had criticized the American Xian right as, say, Margaret Atwood did in her Handmaid's Tale, and Jerry Falwell had then announced that any Xian who runs into him should off Rushdie? To ask the question is to know what the left's response would have been. That would have been ok to denounce, because Falwell represents a despised American religious sector.

    The Rushdie fatwa and the obscene reaction of all too many on the left has driven that author, and leftists like Christopher Hitchens, to seriously reconsider the "morality" of their confreres. Indeed, Rushdie's primary criticism of the left's latest bete noir, George Bush, is that the Bush is too gentle on Muslims.

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  39. Anonymous1:58 PM

    "uninsured for health care" is a lot different than "not getting healthcare"

    Everybody gets healthcare in the US that wants it. Some people make the economic calculation that they won't need insurance, so they don't pay for insurance. The poor are insured by the govt (didn't know that did you?). Then when those who choose not to buy insurance, or their children, get sick, they go into debt.

    It is illegal to deny basic health care in the US for lack of ability to pay. Canadians are all fully insured, yet many of them die waiting for actual health care. I know it is hard for an ideologue like yourself to understand, but I would rather get the actual care, than the false sense of security that govt rationing of health care provides that they settle for up north of us.

    As for Kyoto, you don't cite any sources, you just raise your voice when you should be re-enforcing your argument. At least your first response could be attributed to the pitiful level of critical thinking and ignorance that most Europeans and Canadian suffer from, and so excused. Your point on Kyoto appears to be an outright fabrication.

    But I am willing to look at any evidence you might present.

    --moptop

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  40. Anonymous2:05 PM

    "Justice is about healing, about rehabilitation, about restoring what's been damaged."

    Now we’re getting to the meat of the problem. If this is what the Left understands of justice then it is obvious why a lawful sentence of death is held to be the moral equivalent of a wanton act of murder. Yes, justice does contain the concept of healing and restitution, but only as constituents of the much larger and sublime whole. It is unredeemable jejune to argue that justice is simply the healing of the criminal, as if crime is a disease and prisons are hospitals where the guilty get all better.

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  41. Anonymous2:30 PM

    "By the way, I'm sick of the cross Americans constantly put themselves on with this ridiculous notion that the entire continent of Europe hates you."

    The only cross here Icelander is your eyes. The complaint is about the European Left and not the entire continent of Europe. By the way I'm sick of whiny, stupid Europeans like you who try to project their mentally ill hatred of the finest country in the world, the U.S., onto their fellow countrymen in a vain attempt to bolster its magnitude.

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  42. Anonymous2:35 PM

    Everybody gets healthcare in the US that wants it. Some people make the economic calculation that they won't need insurance, so they don't pay for insurance.

    You don't really mean that, do you? Economic calculation? Really? That's a wonderful way of putting it. I would've said "thanks to a system that puts the burden of healthcare on gaining a job with health benefits (which many working people don't have the luxury of, my white-collar blogger), combined with the mutual backscratching of the health-care professionals and the HMOs leading to prohibitively high costs of private health-insurance." But economic calculation, yea, whatever. You just try getting laid-off and affording Cobra.

    And yea, I do know about Medicare. The system's a joke.

    And you know Canadians have a two-tier system, right? American propaganda is full of these bullshit stories of getting your head beat in and having to wait on some hospital list -- that doesn't happen. Sure, you may have to wait for that corrective nasal passage surgery to ease some discomfort, but you get emergency treatment when you need it.

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  43. "It is regarded as barbaric, since there is no way to obtain justice from the death of another human being. Justice is about healing, about rehabilitation, about restoring what's been damaged. Revenge is about 'you killed one of us, so we'll kill you'. That's the law of the street, that's the law of gangs - and that's what the death penalty is all about."

    I wasn't even going to respond to this silliness since there are far too many misconceptions in it to address them at less than book length, but since someone else has I feel compelled to enlarge the point.

    Yes, this is the meat of the problem. First, Justice has long been defined - indeed as probably first defined - as 'An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.' That many have come to see this definition itself as the definition of barbarism illustrates the lack of awareness on the part of some. Many probably imagine the Code of Hammurabi as being the lowest possible moral standard and the harshest form of law.

    In fact, the whole purpose of the code is to set standards not on the minimum ammount of punishment that can be applied to a crime, but in fact on the maximum.

    The 'code of the street', the natural state of man's behavior, is nothing so enlightened as 'an eye for an eye'. Rather the natural state of man is 'a life for an insult' and a 'hand and a foot for a loaf of bread'. Justice is about making the punishment fit the crime. Interestingly, out in the real world Islamic law represents a pre-Hammurabi code of justice. It does not recognize an 'eye for an eye'.

    Equally important, the 'law of the street' does not recognize crime and punishment to be acts which are related to each and bound temporally. When there is no justice, disputes are never 'settled'. The whole purpose of justice is to bring the dispute to a close. In the law of the street, the law of blood, there is no end to the dispute. Blood demands blood, and there is no end to it. Any form of retribution at all must be met with twice as hard of a retribution. The law of the street is not "a life for a life", but rather "If you slap me, I will slap you twice.", to which the injured party must then retaliate in kind. If party A kills party B, then the death of party A is not considered to settle the issue for either side. Justice involves creating a nuetral party which is empowered to hear the dispute and authorize a settlement which both parties must accept as final. Justice is then, as they say, served.

    But how can justice be served if justice is defined only as something which happens to the criminal, and not something which happens for the victim? It's all well and good to speak of healing the damage the criminal has done to himself, but what about the damage to the victims? When a victim demands justice, they aren't asking that the criminal be healed. They are asking that they be healed. When a murder occurs, you can't restore the victim to life through any sort of punishment or recompense so there is no use pretending that the punishment or recompense of any sort has that purpose. When a murder has occured, alot of things have been damaged other than merely the victim. Among those things in the public trust. The public's belief that the magistrates that they have set over them will act justly and will act to protect them. In other words, the public must believe that the magistrates will grant them justice, otherwise the public will take matters into thier own hands and when that happens the whole carefully constructed edifice of justice is in danger of crashing down. A justice system is not put in place solely for the benefit of the guilty.

    And this is just one of the dangers in pretending that setting a standard of maximum punishment lower than a 'life for a life' is setting a higher moral standard than the ancient one.

    The death penalty is not about revenge. It's not as if the judge is seeking vengence. The death penalty is about preventing revenge.

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  44. Anonymous2:50 PM

    "I assure you, our magnitude does not need bolstering."

    The magnitude or you hatred for America, not the magnitude of your little country.

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  45. Pkease take this as a compliment, but I am totally going to plagiarize you. This post is sheer genius.

    Apologies in advance.

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  46. Anonymous3:26 PM

    Adam Thurschwell claims that anti-Americanism is nothing but what "occurs that right-minded people hold those with whom they most closely identify -- for example, with respect to the European democracies, America -- to a higher standard and expectation of conduct than those with whom they share no such identification -- China and Iran, for example."

    This higher standard argument fails because it twitches the subject. First, we are told that Europeans are interested in reason, in solidarity, and in human rights. Now we are told that they are against the strongest nation, that they are focusing on the only nation where they can make a difference, that they are holding America up to higher standards.

    That would be fine if doing so did not subvert the human standards argument in the first place. Why should you make a fuss about a prisoner who is forced to crawl with a leash aoround his neck and not for someone whose arm was amputated by Saddam's henchmen, whose eyes were torn out by Iran's mullahs, or who was forced to drink the water from his toilet (a hole in the ground) in Stalin's gulag?

    As for the argument that that they are focusing on the only nation where they can make a difference, who is really in need of all the energy, mental and physical, that they are directing against Uncle Sam? The death row murderer whose execution did not occur until after 24 years or the businessman who was shot in the back of the head two days after his trial?

    In any case, if you were honest, you would see that the emotions (anger, revulsion, fury) that "activists", both stateside and abroad, feel when learning of an American "sin" simply don't come up when learning of a (far wrose) sin in (Saddam's) Iraq, China, or North Korea. (There, it's more like, "Oh yeah, we are against that too, by the way".)

    If what the activists claim were true — that their concern is genuine and general for all humanity — you would expect the feelings to be the same, even if later there were a (necessary) intellectual choice when directing a program against a specific target.

    What good does all this so-called human rights posturing against Uncle sam's alleged (minor) sins do for the Kurdish widower, for the Sudanese orphan, for the Chinese widow forced to pay the bullet that blew out her husband's brains (and that, not 24 years after the trial as with Tookie, but the day following a trial in which the defense lawyer was hardly allowed to speak)?

    The answer is it doesn't do them any good at all, and those individuals' persecutors, whether the torturers in question or the country's leaders, are in no way the type to "learn" anything from Uncle Sam serving as a "example" (although their representatives at the UN would argue so — and in speeches that never end).

    There aren't 36 different explanations for focusing on America's molehills while ignoring, downplaying, and explaining the mountains in China, North Korea, and (Saddam's) Iraq. It is anti-Americanism, pure and simple…

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  47. Anonymous3:30 PM

    Whew. Tough getting here from behind The Great Firewall, but it was worth it. I suspect this is the same GG I once corresponded with. New York Jew Lawyer with blazing typing speed? Used to join in vigorously in Compuserve Town Hall during the early Clinton Dynasty?

    Great post, man. The critics are completely predictable (except give credit to the one sneer from Iceland-they are a happy bunch for some reason). Really lovely to see you writing here, and this post follows my read last week of Berman's bit in The New Republic: there is some true, frothing derangement over there, and even though it's really 240 years old, it's now a bigger danger than the sleepy US is aware of.

    Cheers. I'll be back soon. I spent some quality time with Mona a few years ago, haven't heard from her since. John Moore (traditional conserv. from TH) has a blog "Useful Fools", and I never met Frank in person, just his surrogate, that kid.

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  48. Anonymous3:33 PM

    The magnitude or you hatred for America, not the magnitude of your little country.

    I don't hate America. I liked Clinton, I liked Bush I.. I did think Reagan was kind of an idiot, though -- sorry if I'm insulting your god right there. And the only American I've ever gotten into a political fight with here brought his politics up first.. I simply had to respond.

    I believe that the principals upon which America were founded could make it light-years ahead of any country in the world. But I also believe that stupid shit like the death-penalty, the Iraq Invasion and increased bedsharing by corporations and government spoil that.

    I also believe that if America were to live up to its full potential, and seek to form productive instead of reactionary foreign relations, she could help lead the world into a new era. But instead we get pre-emptive unjustified war, while the president cracks jokes about 30,000 dead Iraqis. You've come a long way in 5 years, and I only hope that after '08, y'all start moving in the right direction again.

    But you can call me a hater if you want.

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  49. Linked at American Daughter

    Hope For The Left?

    Glenn Greenwald is a left-leaning retired lawyer from New York City who...writes a weblog called Unclaimed Territory, in which he recently posted a very good definition of anti-Americanism. It is so good, even for a leftie, that we feel compelled to share....

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  50. Anonymous3:49 PM

    What the Euro-Left really hates is classical liberalism -- America is simply a stand-in for that hate. It's the same hate that National Socialist Adolf Hitler had for America -- he hated America because America was the capital of classical liberalism.

    So don't be fooled. Today's Euro-Socialists still have a great deal in common with the old Euro-National Socialists.

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  51. Anonymous3:58 PM

    Whatever else it may be, Williams' execution is not murder. To call it so is to erase the distinction between killing the innocent and killing the guilty.

    But even if it *were* murder in the fullest sense--even if putting Williams to death were just as evil as killing Christians in China--there is still nothing particularly heinous to distinguish this state-sanctioned murder from thousands like it around the world. Why does the euro-left have no outrage for those nations?

    Glenn is certainly correct that much of the double-standard eminates from the reflexive anti-americanism seen on the European Left, which probably springs from marxist sympathy during the cold war. But another reason is: America is a safe target. A Frenchman who criticizes America will suffer no worse fate than the ill-bestowed commendation of his society. But a Frenchman (or Dutchman, obviously) who speaks against Islamic brutality takes his life in his hands. The anti-Americanism of the European Left can in part be attributed to (probably subconsious) cowardice.

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  52. Anonymous3:59 PM

    Adam Thurschwell--Your argument doesn't hold up when compared to the actual statements of many on the European left. British MP George Galloway, a hero for the Euro-left, has said that if the west goes to war with North Korea, he'll support the Koreans. Ken Livingston, mayor of London, said Bush is the greatest threat to life on this planet. And did you read Harold Pinter's Nobel acceptance speech? These aren't cases of criticizing someone from whom you expect better behavior. Many members of the European left sincerely believe the U.S. under Bush is the most evil regime in the world. The U.S. is far from perfect, but if you look at Cuba (imprisoning dissidents and AIDS patients [I hope that last fact causes some internal conflicts for some libs]); China, NK (no explaination needed for either, really), then you cannot hold that position in good faith.

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  53. Anonymous4:01 PM

    "these bullshit stories of getting your head beat in and having to wait on some hospital list -- that doesn't happen."

    I personally know of a case in the past month, I live on the border with Soviet Canuckistan, where an elderly woman slipped and her arm was plunged into a pot of steaming cabbage. She waited in the emergency room all night, then the next day, she was put into a germ free burn unit.

    But I wasn't talking about "getting your head beat in", I was talking about cancer, and heart bypasses.

    Ooh, here is a story from yesterday on Canadian "waitlists", a foreign concept here in the US.

    http://www.brandonsun.com/story.php?story_id=13278

    Or this, which is a commentary, so I guess you can dismiss it as a pack of lies:

    "The cash-strapped system discourages expenditure for new facilities and equipment and there are not enough doctors and nurses to meet the ever-increasing demand. At Vancour General Hospital, for example, ambulances at times have to wait in the parking lot in frigid weather to deliver sick patients. Even heart attack victims may have to wait an hour or so for the treatment that according to accepted standards should be given within 15 minutes of arrival in the emergency department."

    And this:

    "The bulk of ordinary Canadians have no choice but to put up with long delays and wait their turn in line. Then there are others, certainly a minority, who because of their connections jump the line and get prompt and timely treatment. And then there is the American connection."

    http://toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051205/COLUMNIST12/512040327/-1/NEWS04

    Canadians now have a two tier system because a judge ordered it, if I am not mistaken, in order to allow cancer patients to get timely care. Yeesh!

    Your original statement was that 14 million American children had no access to health carre. Now you say "medicare is a joke" based on what? The Canadian health care system is the joke, and I have at least provided reasons to back up that statement.

    And on the Kyoto thing, I am still waiting, and I am still pretty sure you made it up completel, 95%... This is why we think you guys are idiots, you make statements, so emphatically, that you can't back up. As if just saying them made them true.

    I am a reasonable guy. I am willing to listen. I just don't hear anything but huffing and puffing coming from you. Your news media feeds you agitprop, get over it.

    In the '60s we used to have a saying here, which we on the right cling to: "question authority". You should try it.

    --moptop.

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  54. Anonymous4:21 PM

    Someone should sit the European Left down and tell them that just because they have a long history of supporting Royalist and fascist governments that executed political prisoners, dissidents, the mentally infirm, Gypsies, and other "racial degenerates" and a corresponding guilt complex over it, doesn't mean they are either morally superior, or that the death penalty in the US is in any way related to their prior ethical lapses. The US, unlike Europe, has never had a dictatorial or Royalist government, and executes prisoners not for political gain or ethnic cleansing, but for real crimes like the brutal and senseless murders Tookie performed, and as you mentioned after 24 years of appeals and due process, as defined by the laws of our Republic.

    But then, as you so aptly observe, denigrating the US is the goal, how else to explain their complete silence over far more heinous abuses by others.

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  55. Anonymous4:33 PM

    I believe Proust said that opposites converge. Nowhere is that more apparent than the Euro left. Their hatred of America revolves around their hatred of freedom opportunity and individual determination not ruled by them.Their veneration of evil dictators is simply their wish to rule with this degree of ruthlessness. A great clash of cultures between Islam and liberal democracy is underway ironically George Bush is the only determined leader to effect a ruthless opposition to the tyranny that Islamic extremism would produce. Never forget that the events of the 20th century can repeat themselves.

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  56. Anonymous4:50 PM

    I agree with the original post. Most of the comments have been illuminating. What a shame that anti-Americanism on the left is preventing the "West" from presenting a united front to its real adversaries. I, for one, see another preventable blood-bath in Europe's future. It will be tragic if that happens....and when it does, will the U.S. have a dog in that fight or will the years of anti-Americanism have severed any compulsion we may have to come to the aid of our "brothers and sisters"...AGAIN.

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  57. Anonymous4:59 PM

    Good Posting.

    In theory, however, I can see why someone would expect better behaviour from a modern American that someone living in a country that hasn't left the middle ages.

    And be more upset when it the American didn't come through.

    Of course, that's different from lauding the pre-modern countries.

    Darfur is the issue that stands for uneven criticism for me. No one's marching in the street over that though a black, Muslim minority is being massacred and abused. Wonder why? Maybe because it's not being done by a Western country.

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  58. Glenn Greenwald is a left-leaning retired lawyer from New York City who...writes a weblog called Unclaimed Territory, in which he recently posted a very good definition of anti-Americanism. It is so good, even for a leftie, . . .

    Wow, so much packed into this one little back-handed compliment. "Retired" makes me sound like I´m 70. I'm barely half that. And I didn´t stop practicing law to go play shuffleboard in Florida, just to pursue other things that interested me more. As for the "leftie" bit, it's true that I think that the Administration's handling of the Iraqi war has been inept and corrupt beyond belief, and I think GOP hegemony is as bad of a thing as Democratic hegemony is, but I have countless positions far closer to the right side than to the left. But I know some people need to box everyone into one side or the other, so don't let me stop you.

    As for the commenters who are angry about the post, including many of the regular readers here, I'd love to hear someone defend the sentiment that seeks to re-name a stadium after a mass murderer - or defend a political movement which stands idly by while its allies systematically violate every principle they claim to believe in.

    Just because the European Left hates Bush and you do, too, doesn't mean that they don't have glaring and profound faults that deserve condemnation. The enemy of your enemy may be your friend as a tactical matter, but as an intellectual and moral matter, it is incredibly corrupt to overlook their faults - or, worse, pretend they don't exist - just because you think they help push your agenda forward.

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  59. Anonymous5:14 PM

    OK, would the real Anonymous stand up and identify yourselves. REading the comments here leads one to believe that we have a case of multiple pesonality disorder talking to it(them)selve(s).

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  60. "I can tell every American who hears this rebuttal "we are not anti-american - you'd know that if you lived here!" - thats Bullcrap"

    Allow me to expand on that point.

    Another commmon rebuttal is, "We are not anti-American, we are just opposed to George Bush.", or some variation of that.

    That's also Bullcrap. Virtually all the Europeans I knew/know were/are bizarre mixtures of rabidly anti-American and 'Yankophiles' based on some rather bizarre misperceptions of US law, custom, and history long before any of them had ever heard of George W. Bush. For those that doubt my claim as mere ancedotal evidence, I invite people to speak to as many people who have lived in Europe as possible. I also invite you to watch the rather excellent and spot-on movie 'Barcelona' about US-European relations long before any policy of George W. Bush.

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  61. And as for the claim that the European Left is just holding us to higher standards because they love us more - what planet are you living on? What do they ever say which remotely suggests that? They want to strip Arnold Schwarzenegger of his citizenship because they love him like a wayward brother? They march in support of governments and countries which put homosexuals and adulturers to death and dissidents in jail because they don't love them as much and therefore don't mind if they go around abusing the very principles of human rights they claim to believe in as a universal matter?

    If you claim to believe in Principle X and Human Right Y, there is simply no excuse for overlooking and even embracing those societies which] violate those severely and deliberately, while raling viciously against those who don't.

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  62. Anonymous5:24 PM

    It's not a Mulim minority. I am sure this will shock everybody, but the genocide is being carried out by the religion that can't get along with the others against Christians and animists.

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  63. "So, when is the US going to do something about the tens of millions of children not getting healthcare? "

    Here's a better question: Who in Europe is going to pay for it in 10, 20 or 30 years? Europeans simply don't reproduce at rates that will support their welfare states. Oh, the immigrants do, but look at the sorry state of immigration in Europe. You think the riots in Paris are an accident? You can crow about "income inequality" all you want, but what you have is a large and growing immigration population that is increasingly hostile to European culture (yes, I am using a slight generalization here, calm down) as we've known it for the past fifty years.

    So, what exactly are Europeans going to do about it? Can anyone answer that? This is not simply about bashing "lousy foreigners." A culture that cannot assimilate its immigrants has a clock ticking over its head.

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  64. Anonymous5:29 PM

    "I am an American who has lived in Germany for over 20 years"

    I heard a comedian say something funny the other day. He said wars were better when the Germans just admitted that they were on the other side openly.
    --moptop

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  65. Alicia-FL,

    There IS nothing wrong with opposing the death penalty, and no one (certainly not Glenn) is making that argument. It is right, however, to oppose the perversion of European leftists in equating the execution of a multi-murderer to Nazism. Frankly, it's morally reprehensible and irresponsible to do so.

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  66. Anonymous5:46 PM

    Why execute a role-model of the black youngsters, who - agreed! - once did an awful terrible thing, but was converted and tried very hard to keep these kids on the straight-and-narrow

    To say Williams was 'converted' is to have drunk the Kool Aid bigtime.

    This thug was responsible not only for several cold blooded murders himself, but also for unleasing massive bloodshed in which the main victims were poorer people and minorities. He NEVER "converted" .. he just found a way to get the limosine liberals happy with him.

    He never denounced the gang violence, never ever apologized to the victims - indeed, after having admited to murders he committed decided to deny it later when it was convenient. but not very strenuously or convincingly.

    I lived in LA when the Crips and Bloods killed many kids in driveby shootings. It was Williams that took the Crips from a small local gang to a murderous group of thugs that terrorized that and other cities for years before the gang was broken - in part by Jamaican gangs who moved into the drugs trade and who were not just murderous but crazy as well.

    "converted" my ass.

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  67. Anonymous6:10 PM

    It is right, however, to oppose the perversion of European leftists in equating the execution of a multi-murderer to Nazism. Frankly, it's morally reprehensible and irresponsible to do so.

    Don't you understand, this is exactly how Nazis BEGAN - by claiming, like you do, the right to decide who deserves to live and die. Sure, you think you are making that decision well, but so did they. We can't trust human beings to decide which other human beings should live and die.

    That's why the lessons which the Europeans have drawn from the Holocaust is that the ONLY safe way to proceed is to deny other people the right to make this decision at all.

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  68. Anonymous6:46 PM

    Dear Mr. Greenwald,
    "l'Autriche en rêve, la France l'a fait".
    In 2003 Paris Mayor Delanoë awarded cop-killer Mumia Abu-Jamal an honorary Parisian citizenship http://www.grioo.com/info898.html
    In an exquisitely Orwellian touch, the communist newspaper "Humanité" expressed its revulsion at the death penalty, a disgustingly American institution
    http://www.humanite.presse.fr/journal/2002-05-25/2002-05-25-34351

    Thank you for the breath of fresh air in a most filthy anti-American atmosphere.
    Yours friendly,
    Attila

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  69. Alicia,

    I respect your argument vis-a-vis the death penalty; however, I am neither arguing for nor against it. It is utter nonsense to suggest that the Nazis BEGAN by instituting the death penalty against convicted murderers. They thought they were making their decision well? Certainly, they did, and by doing so they killed on the order of 6 million Jews. What the devil does this have to do with penalizing criminals? Yes, I understand your position--we have no moral right to determine who lives or dies--I get it. It's also beside the point. My original point is that it's repugnant to pull out the Nazi card to gain an argumentative foothold.

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  70. Anonymous7:37 PM

    The left in europe is commited to the destruction of the evidence that the philosopher-fuhrer (trans-national-socialism) model they love to imagine ruling is a miserable failure when compared with personal economic freedom (capitalism).

    As a member of one of the peoples of Europe I am commited to the EUSSRs destruction before it goes the way of the previous European "unity" projects that have emerged from Germany last century.

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  71. Anonymous7:40 PM

    Congratulations on this great article, Glenn. I'm writting this from Spain, where the extreme-far-left rules.

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  72. Anonymous7:43 PM

    Ok, Alicia, You say:
    Don't you understand, this is exactly how Nazis BEGAN - by claiming, like you do, the right to decide who deserves to live and die. Sure, you think you are making that decision well, but so did they. We can't trust human beings to decide which other human beings should live and die.

    But let me ask you two things, where were you when Terri Shiavo was sentenced to die? And what is your take on Partial birth abortion? I won't even ask about abortion, just the late term, viable baby.... Are you truly a "Right to life" person? Lets see your true colors.

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  73. Anonymous7:44 PM

    I'm against the death penalty, but also see through the Europeans' anti-Americanism. Interesting how they are only concerned with so-called abuses in the U.S. while there are plenty other countries that have the death penalty. Yet they turn a blind eye. I believe that their relentless obsession with inner American politics is a diversionary tactic from their own domestic problems. They are like sheep being led by the European press and their political leaders to concentrate on the U.S.'s ills.

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  74. Anonymous7:49 PM

    We "anti-American" "European Left" could just as easily have written a passionate article about how everytime we disagree with the US we're labeled as "anti-American", or proponents of terrorism. Don't be so paranoid about criticism, because really, if you look carefully, there was no anti-Americanism in that article. It's incredibly naive to tar all left-leaning people in Europe with a brush as wide as the Champs d'Elysee is long, as you did by attributing comments made by a few to the "European Left".

    Your remarks about the Holocaust are completely ridiculous. We Europeans don't feel morally superior because of what happened, but rather reserve the right to choose to oppose the death penalty because of it.

    "The Holocaust did not happen to the European Left. At best, they are neutral observers of it, and in reality, are by-products of the societies and historical roots which produced it.". The fact that the Second World War happened just over 60 years ago, means that even today it is a relatively recent event. People are alive still who remember, and regret, what happened. Had you ever been to a concentration camp you would not be so quick to say that we're neutral observers.

    As for your claim that it is the wish of the "European Left" to rename monuments in memory of convicted murderers, if you read the article it was "suggested" by a "christian political group" in Graz. Not mentioned in the article however was the other suggestion that it be named after the Jewish football team Hakoah. [1][2]

    I think your article is best summarised by the words of Bush himself when he said "You're either with us or against us". Just because we disagree with *some* of your actions, doesn't mean we're against you. As you said yourself:

    "This notion that anybody who is "on your side" with regard to some specific issue(s) ought to be - for that reason alone - immune from criticism no matter their sins and excesses is one of the more corrupt and destructive beliefs floating around."

    [1] http://derstandard.at/?url=/?id=2275527
    [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hakoah_Vienna

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  75. Anonymous7:52 PM

    Alicia,

    You got it wrong. The Nazi came with a group to blame for Germany's problems, namely Jews. This is entirely unlike this U.S. execution where there are processes and procedures designed to achieve fairness within a legal context, regardless of whether you agree this was achieved in Williams instance. Choice and discretion marks a moral society.

    In fact, your description of Europe's lesson learned is perfect as it opts from making any choices. A perfectly amoral society emerges where all killing is wrong, and Europe can't distinguish between mass murderers and an execution of a mass murderer following a mumber of legal appeals.

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  76. Anonymous7:54 PM

    the wolf speaks sense: It is utter nonsense to suggest that the Nazis BEGAN by instituting the death penalty against convicted murderers.

    I'm not a fan of Godwin's Law, since on occasion invocation of Nazis holds some merit as analogy and cautionary tale. But if one is going to make recourse to the Third Reich, one should at least get the facts straight.

    Hitler and Stalin both put people in prison; from that it does not follow that prison is never a proper penalty after a conviction that took place per the due process of law. The inane "reasoning" of some of the leftists in these comments has amply demonstrated the points in Glenn's original post. ANYTHING, no matter how logically absurd, factually incorrect, or grossly hypocritical is permitted to the far left, as long as it promotes a depiction of America as bad.

    (And I tend to oppose the death penalty, but as noted by others, one's position on that issue is irrlevant to the main points Glenn raised.)

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  77. "Don't you understand, this is exactly how Nazis BEGAN - by claiming, like you do, the right to decide who deserves to live and die."

    And, as has been posted before, it's also how the Europeans FINISHED the Nazi regime: through mass-application of the death penalty. If what you imply is true (that applying the death penalty leads to Nazism), then why didn't it immediately start over again with the Nuremburg trials?

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  78. Anonymous8:10 PM

    "Virtually all the Europeans I knew/know were/are bizarre mixtures of rabidly anti-American and 'Yankophiles' based on some rather bizarre misperceptions of US law, custom, and history"

    Mostly gleaned from depictions of life in America from Hollywood movies and TV shows. Which, as anyone who lives here can attest, is so way off the mark as to be depicting life not in a different country, but life on a different planet.

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  79. Anonymous8:16 PM

    The reason that Europeans are against the death penalty is that their governments use it to exterminate rival ethnic groups. The reason we Americans support the death penalty is that we have a different and superior history. Simply put, European governments have proven themselves far too politically immature to responsibly administer the death penalty. America, on the other hand, has limited the application of the death penalty to criminals tried and found guilty in court.

    Tantor

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  80. Anonymous8:21 PM

    And by the way, the Nazis began the Holocaust by euthanizing the mentally ill, people whom they found "unworthy of life," not by executing criminals as erroneously posted earlier. The definition of those unworthy of life continued to expand under the Hitler administration in a bureaucratic process the Nazis informally called "working toward the Fuehrer."

    Tantor

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  81. Anonymous8:27 PM

    America didn't "learn the lesson of the Holocaust" because we were the teacher of that lesson:

    It takes a war to stop a Holocaust.

    The Euros still haven't learned it. Either we were lousy teachers or -- more likely -- they're lousy students.

    Our application of the lesson applies just as surely to gang murderers as to dictatorial ones.

    Class dismissed.

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  82. Anonymous8:42 PM

    As an american who was also born in England it is my fervent hope that one day before I die England will split from these nauseating anti american euro fascists and join strategically and economically with England. Incidentally if the Holocaust was the reason the death penalty was abolished in Europe why did it take until 1977 that was the date I believe the last person was guillotined by the French.

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  83. Anonymous8:56 PM

    Great post, and great set of comments too. I have to also recommend people watch the movie "Barcelona". It really is a smart, well done, & pretty funny movie about 2 American guys living(well, 1 visting) in Spain during the "last decade of the cold war". Good stuff.


    btw, only people who know next to nothing about the Nazis pull the Nazi card at every possible convenience. To those people, I say read "Berlin Diary" and/or "Rise & Fall of the Third Riech" & maybe I'll believe you. Of course, you won't be mentioning it so often, so maybe I won't have to believe you.

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  84. Anonymous9:24 PM

    "But how can justice be served if justice is defined only as something which happens to the criminal, and not something which happens for the victim? It's all well and good to speak of healing the damage the criminal has done to himself, but what about the damage to the victims?"

    Excuse me, but that's not what I said. Please get rid of the narrow vision goggles and read again:

    Justice is about healing, about rehabilitation, about restoring what's been damaged. Period. Primarily for the victim, naturally. I can't believe I have to emphasize that! Taking another human's life can NEVER heal, rehabilitate, nor restore what's been damaged. It can only satisfy a yearning for revenge, and the State is the instrument that provides it.

    But let's not mix the different views on the capital esentence with the 'anti-american feelings'. Though they are related in this particular case, they usually are not. What really strikes me as odd is that it is apparently considered good practice to bully anyone who opposes you. It's very cheap to hide behind a well-known difference in views (namely the death penalty) and use that to ridicule and bagatellise all critisism, claiming it all just originates from 'general anti-american sentiment'. What a crap.

    I couldn't believe my eyes when the Bosnia-Herzegovina issue popped up. Do you have any idea what really happened there? Do you have any idea what role the US played in this war? Are you being informed by your press?

    I've lived in the Netherlands for all my life, and I do notice an increased distrust in the US. That's partly due to the mere fact that several US governments in the recent history have lied flat-out. Europe has been lured into a war nobody really wanted, but our great friend the US assured us there were WMD's, so we supported them, despite strong opposition from the UN and the public. The US government assured us there was no torturing in US prisons in Iraq, so we supported them. They assured us there were no secret camps in Europa, and no secret CIA flights - just to name a few blatant lies. In retrospect, the US government has known all along there were no WMD's, they new about the torture, they do have secret prisoner camps without the governments of the countries involved knowing it, and if you analyse the very cautious answers (or should I say: non-answers) Rice gave during her visit last week, I would not be surprised if the CIA flights our Intelligence Service claim to have proof of, really do exist.

    We blame our own government for believing these lies, and joke about them acting as Bush's pet dog. After all, they fell for it: hook, line and sinker. They sent our guys into a war. They can't get away with 'knowing what we know now, it would have been better not to join Bush'. At the next elections, they will pay the price.

    However, we have no way to hold the US government accountable for all the lies they told, since the US does not recognize any international court and simply denies everything, even if the evidence is clear. Guantanomo Bay a violation of the Geneva Convention? Who cares, Geneva Conventions don't apply. Secret POW-camps in Europe? Their existence is denied, until there's nothing left to deny. Torture? No sirrr, just 'special interrogation techniques', and no, we can't explain the bruises and scars 'cause that would interfere with our investigation. But trust us, in each *specific* case, all applied methods were fully justified and no, there's no need to provide more information so the Red Cross can verify the treatment of POW's. After all, the US is morally superior, so why should anyone else judge them? So that's up to you, the American voters. All we can do is express that we're not amused with the lies we've been told. That's really frustrating, and I understand it may look like a generic anti-american attitude. It is not. We're just pissed off at your administration.

    Furthermore, if you look at the US Bush approval rate, we're not alone in that sentiment. Forget about those lefties in Austria. The Bush administration has a problem with approximately the entire world, including half the population of the US. Now, could that just maybe, MAYBE, have something to do with the way the US government acts? Just maybe?

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  85. Anonymous9:39 PM

    Re: the death penalty, of which I do not approve because I have a libertarian streak that I just can't kill.

    "It was a mistake to call a referendum for the European Constitution. I mean, there are issues on which we simply must not let the public decide. If you ask Germans about the death penalty, for instance, some 70% will vote to have it reinstated."

    --a German professor

    So Alicia and all other EUSSR fetishists, you're more than welcome to Eurabia.

    Socialist nomenklatura. It's what's for dinner.

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  86. Anonymous9:59 PM

    Gert Jan writes: Taking another human's life can NEVER heal, rehabilitate, nor restore what's been damaged. It can only satisfy a yearning for revenge, and the State is the instrument that provides it.

    Locking a human being in a prison cell can NEVER heal, rehabilitate, nor restore what's been damaged. It can only satisfy a yearning for revenge, and the State is the instrument that provides it. Yet, we imprison convicted criminals, both in the U.S.. and in Europe. This is not the place for a treatise on theories of penal justice, but revenge in NOT the only purpose of criminal sanctions. Retribution is also a factor. Satisfying the need for justice of the victims, their families, and society is also a purpose. If the state does not punish wrongdoers, the mob will; a major step on the road to civilization has been the state meting out punishment under the rule of decent law. If and to the extent the state should cease doing that, the mob will reappear.

    In any event, your post is teeming with falsehoods and/or unsupported accusations about Bush and the United States. He did not lie about WMDs; virtually everyone thought Saddam had them, including the British and the UN. And all these CIA prisons and torture chambers? What is the evidence from a credible source for these accusations?

    The left's simply deranged hatred of America, in Europe and in the U.S., is amply demonstrated by the historical record, which also shows that this attitude well, well precedes the Bush administration. That some on the left would remove one of our governor's name from monuments and replace it with that of a vicious murderer who founded violent gangs, is only the latest manifestation of a pervasive, hypocritical, and well-documented animus against the U.S. by many on the left.

    BTW, there is an exception to widely held hatred of America abroad, and that is the general attitude toward the U.S. held by intellectuals and others hailing from Eastern Europe and the former Soviet bloc. Oddly, they don't think we are a good example of the worst human rights abuses on the planet. Perhaps that is because they have so recently experienced an actual evil system that the U.S. stood strongly against.

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  87. Too much time and efforts over overly vocal lefties from a dying region of the world. Their anti-Americanism is neither holding America to a higher standard nor beholden to some lofty moral principles, their cries are just gasps of desperation.

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  88. Anonymous11:47 PM

    You self-righteous Europeans who have committed horrifying atrocities throughout history, your Holocausts, your genocides, your murderous Crusades, your pogroms, your slavery of millions, your Hundred Years wars, not to mention two World Wars that killed millions and millions, your evil and tyrannical Marxism and Communism, your Fascism, your murder of millions of South Americans, your illegal conquests and lootings, your colonizations, invasions, land-grabbings -- you self-righteous assh-les are absolutely in NO POSITION to lecture the United States about human rights and imperialism!

    You and your ancestors are guilty of abominable sins throughout history. To smugly criticize the United States, as if you are morally superior, is absolutely disgusting and infuriating.

    You live in rich countries parttly because of the untold riches you have looted from your historic victims. Have your paid for your thievery, slavery and murder enough? Have you given reparations to your victims' descendants even remotely enough to pay for what you have ill-gotten? You have ABSOLUTELY NO RIGHT to feel morally superior! How dare you, descendants of thieves, slavers, exploiters, colonizers, murderers, invaders, bringers of sickness and death! HOW DARE YOU LECTURE ANYBODY!

    You say that you have learned from your ancestors past sins, and that is the reason why you criticize the United States. But the way you strut yourselves is sickening! People who are sorry for their sins and want to help others avoid commiting the same mistakes, ACT HUMBLE, and speak HUMBLY, because they know that they themselves are tainted with sin. Instead, you people show a disgusting sense of self-righteousness, as if you, your governments, your corporations, and your countries are lily-white.

    You Europeans, when you criticize others, should remember how you yourselves behaved in the past. Truly reformed people with horrible pasts act with humility because they know they have no right to claim moral superiority.

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  89. Anonymous12:58 AM

    On the secondary topic here of people in the US without health insurance, yes, there are many for whom that is an economic decision. Generally, employers offer a group plan which is partially subsidized, but not mandatory. It is not uncommon, I've seen it myself, for young adults who see themselves as invulnerable to look at the cost of participation and decline because they prefer to spend the money on more enjoyable expenses.

    I'm not sure how they are counting now, but when the numbers of "uninsured" first started getting tossed around they were actually numbers of people getting health care and paying for it themselves. At that particular time my household was participating in a plan, not thru work, which provided "major medical" only, and paying out of pocket for routine care. We were thus possibly miscounted as being uninsured.

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  90. Anonymous2:01 AM

    There is no true difference between executing a mass murderer and locking them up until they die anyway, having lived a horrible life in prison.

    Both ways, they die.

    The latter alternative simply allows a vacuous idea of moral superiority for those who advocate it ... much like being against killing animals, but buing meat from the butcher, anyway.

    I would choose the former alternative, if it were me.

    All of us have a death sentence. So what?

    Eliminating the legal death sentence means that those who kill prision guards, fellow prisoners or prison
    helpers (maybe your beloved daughter, doing a social work internship in a prison)have nothing to fear whatsoever.

    A sociopath's dream come true.

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  91. Anonymous3:17 AM

    Dave,

    Indeed.

    Did I forget to mention that your daughter's un-executed killer would continue to enjoy more rights than nearly all other humans ...

    including an absoulute right to any and all medical care, bed and board, fitness facilities, legal services, and tons of sympathy from the usual suspects ... for the rest of his natural life ... without any contribution or work on his part whatsoever?

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  92. Anonymous4:56 AM

    Californio:

    "Perhaps the anti- feelings are rooted in our desire for action. If someone does not act to do something to address a problem, we become frustrated. Europeans (I surmise) shrug and sigh and say "what can be done, it doesn't matter." Re: Death Penalty - friendly Europeans, understand that if the state (i.e. government) fails to provide Justice - we Americans will engage in self-help. Yes, in the past this meant lynch mobs. So which is better (and it really is a choice between one or the other only) law, trials, appeals, etc or simply shrugging and knowing that the victims (and their friends and family) will seek their own form of justice.

    Really, Euro criticism on a global scale is harmless - just like they are. What will motivate them to harm American is the very basic vices of greed, envy and their own unique form of sloth.

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  93. Anonymous7:29 AM

    So basically, the lesson comes down to this. If someone critizes you, just put your fingers in your ears and yell "You are not perfect, so you have no right to point at any of my vaults. In fact, I don't have any vaults. By the way, your mother is fat, your grandfather was a bastard and your great-grandmother was a whore! Na-na-na-na-na!"

    Really, if the only way you know to counter critisism is just to point at your critics vaults (or their parents, or even older ancesters, or even the mistakes of people who live a thousand kilometers away), then you really need to grow up.

    Regarding the evidence about the lies: just listen to your President. "Our intelligence was wrong, but removing Saddam was the right thing to do." He knew very well the intelligence was wrong, since it was doctored to suit the political plans of Bush Jr, who wanted to finish the job of Bush Sr. There's clear evidence about that, just read (e.g.) the Downing Street Memo's. Did you already forget the UN did not endorse the attack? At the time, the UN were regarded pussy's, and America knew best. In retrospect, the UN was right in hesitating, because - as their inspectors told them - there were no WMD's, and the US troops followed a leader that misled them. I hoped the US citizens had learned from that experience.

    Regarding the CIA flights: over 400 have been documented by Intelligence Services. There are testimonies, there's footage. The POW-camps are there too. Just google for Camp Bondsteel in Kosovo.

    There has been an outrage in Europe about the Kosovo war years before the US got interested. But one thing we learned from the past is that interfering in others people's lives is not by definition the right thing to do. The instability in the Balkan region since the beginning of the last century is largely due to external pressure, aiming to solve internal problems. The first world war originated there. The heavy burden (both financially and morally) that was laid on the Germans for years after the first world war provided the environment that Hitler needed to create his evil empire. The efforts to support local seperatist groups in the Balkan seemed benificial in the years of the cold war, but turned out catastrophically for the entire region. The same applies for the guerilla's in Kazachstan, Tchetchenia and other former Russian states, that were trained and supported by the CIA in the 80's. After the USSR desintegrated, the CIA lost their interest and left - but the region is still on fire. The instability in the Middle-East is also largely due to external interference: think about the creation of the state of Israël by the UN, the support for the Mudjahedien in Afghanistan and both the Taliban and Al-Q'aida in Iraq, which were all funded and trained by the CIA at some point in their history... Not-intervening is not a matter of being a coward. It's merely a matter of having learned the hard way that (military) intervention is not by definition the best way to go. And yeah, a lot of these interventions have been done by the US (though not solely; the French wreaked a lot of havoc in Algeria too, just to name one) and no, I can't helping thinking the American 'desire for action' is at least partly fueled by less superior intentions, apart from 'spreading democracy'.

    And no, I'm most definitely not saying the Europeans are perfect. We're not. Not by any means, not by far.

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  94. Anonymous11:49 AM

    I despise and loathe Europe and Europeans. I'd like to incinerate the entire God-forsaken continent.

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  95. Anonymous2:07 PM

    It will be interesting to watch all these people's reactions when the executions of John William King and Lawrence Russell Brewer, the pickup dragging lynchers, come due.

    Bingo.

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  96. The following statements are counterhistorical outrages.

    The Holocaust did not happen to the European Left. At best, they are neutral observers of it, ... - Glenn

    In fact the first victims of Hitler's round-ups, summary executions, and concentration camps (beginning with Dachau in 1933) were German leftists, particularly Communists and Social Democrats. The European Left had extensive, first-person, decidedly non-neutral experience of Hitler's terror and mass murder.

    If you mean "the Holocaust" to refer to the specific campaign of terror, slavery, and extermination that he directed against European Jews, then it's certainly true that non-Jewish European Leftists were not victims of that (by definition). But so what? I rather expect that the Jewish Leftists in Europe weren't "neutral observers" of that, and the claim that non-Jewish Leftists were "at best, ... neutral observers" at the time is demonstrably false.

    The reason that Europeans are against the death penalty is that their governments use it to exterminate rival ethnic groups. The reason we Americans support the death penalty is that we have a different and superior history. - Tantor

    Anyone with even a passing familiarity with the history of the death penalty in the United States (whether formally approved by a court or executed, with more or less open police complicity, under lynch law), as it applies to Black people in the South and immigrants in the North and West, ought to find this claim laughable, if the facts being blanked out were not so terrible.

    N.B.: the fact that whites in America have an ugly history of using the death penalty as a tool of racial terror does not make the use of the death penalty as a tool of ethnic terror in Europe O.K., or any less bad. If you are going to argue from history, however, you do have a responsibility to begin from actual history and not your mythistorical fantasies.

    The following statements involve elementary errors of fact.

    PS As far as I understand, governors are only supposed to give clemency if they have doubts about the case, i.e. not their opinion re. the death penalty. But why let minor details get in the way of a good antiUS story? - blubi101

    This is not true. The Governor of California holds the authority to grant reprieve, pardon, or commutation of sentence, under Article 5 Section 8 of the California Constitution, as a discretionary power that he or she can exercise "on conditions the Governor deems proper." There is no constitutional or statutory limitation on the reasons that he or she can give for clemency, and they certainly include doubts about the death penalty in general and doubts about the justice of inflicting it in a particular case.

    The European left says nothing about the thousands of political prisoners executed in China. Zero, zip, nada. Until they generate at least the same amount of faux moral outrage over the true evil regimes in the world, their phony protests mean nothing to me. - Lou Minatti

    Lou Minatti could have disabused himself of this error by doing elementary research on European left groups. For example: "Amnesty International was founded in 1961 by a British lawyer named Peter Benenson. Benenson was reading his newspaper and was shocked and angered to come across the story of two Portuguese students sentenced to seven years in prison – for the crime of raising their glasses in a toast to freedom. Benenson wrote to David Astor, editor of The Observer newspaper, who, on May 28, published Benenson's article entitled The Forgotten Prisoners [1] that asked readers to write letters showing support for the students. The response was so overwhelming that within a year groups of letter writers had formed in more than a dozen countries, writing to defend victims of injustice wherever they might be. By mid-1962, Amnesty had groups working or forming in West Germany, Belgium, Switzerland, Netherlands, Norway, Sweden, Ireland, Canada, Ceylon, Greece, Australia, the United States, New Zealand, Ghana, Israel, Mexico, Argentina, Jamaica, Malaya, Congo (Brazzaville), Ethiopia, Nigeria, Burma, and India. Later in that year, a member of one of these groups, Diana Redhouse, designed Amnesty's Candle and Barbed-Wire logo." (Source: WikiPedia: Amnesty International.) By any reasonable standard, the British-founded, London-based Amnesty is an example of the European Left. Amnesty also says a lot about human rights abuses, including the torture and murder of political prisoners, in China. I conclude that Lou Minatti has not done the basic background research needed to make himself less than ignorant about the European left. That only leaves the question of why he insists on talking about it.

    The following statements involve grave conceptual confusions.

    Whatever else it may be, Williams' execution is not murder. To call it so is to erase the distinction between killing the innocent and killing the guilty. - Anonymous

    2. Legal execution is not murder, which is illegal by definition. Every death is not murder, look it up. - Jabba the Tutt

    Legally authorized premeditated killing is often rightly considered murder. For example, the Nazi Einsatzgruppen were acting well within the limits of German law and under direct orders from their government when they rounded up and summarily slaughtered about 1,200,000 Jews in Soviet territory. But so what? That was an act of mass murder, and the law has nothing at all to do with that fact.

    You might claim that there are relevant differences between wanton mass slaughter and the execution of convicted criminals after the appeals process has been exhausted and clemency denied, that make the former murder and the latter some other kind of premeditated deliberate killing. That's fine, but you have to give some argument for that position. Pointing at statute-books and trying to avoid the discussion by way of conceptual gerrymanderings will not do.

    If Europe has learned so much from the Holocaust, why did they create new death camps in the Balkans in the 1990s? - Anonymous

    "Europe" created new death camps in the Balkans in the 1990s? All of them at once, or one at a time?

    If "anti-American" means anything, I'd say it means an inclination to blame America for every world problem, and to vigilantly search for America's guilt while downplaying, ignoring, or excusing the guilt of its enemies. - Glenn

    This is sheer obscurantism. If "anti-American" means anything, it means "against America;" if you want to coin some new term to discuss people who have "an inclination to blame America for every world problem, and to vigilantly search for America's guilt while downplaying, ignoring, or excusing the guilt of its enemies," you're free to do so, but I have no idea why you think that this psychologistic reading has anything to do with the way that the word "anti-American" (as in: anti-Americanism, anti-American sentiment, anti-American activism, anti-American protests, anti-American politics, etc.) has thus far been used in political discussion.

    The following statements commit overt logical fallacies.

    If the death penalty is so barbaric, why is a significant proportion of Europe's population in favour of it? - blubi101

    This is a fallacy of appeal to the people. The number of Europeans who favor the death penalty has no logical bearing whatsoever on whether or not the death penalty is barbaric.

    You self-righteous Europeans who have committed horrifying atrocities throughout history, ... you self-righteous assh-les are absolutely in NO POSITION to lecture the United States about human rights and imperialism! - Anonymous

    This is a textbook case of the argumentum ad hominem. The fact that Europeans have committed atrocities in the past has absolutely no logical bearing whatsoever on whether or not charges of imperialism and human rights violations by the United States are or aren't accurate.

    While there is an argument to be made that things like the Holocaust (not to mention the two world wars spawned by European countries in Europe) should no longer be used to suggest that the Europeans have an inherent propensity towards violence and savagery, those historical events certainly cannot be used, as Europeans and their worshipers try to do, to prove the opposite – namely, that Europe is somehow now the central repository for moral wisdom and universal human rights such that they have some unique ability to decree what is and is not just. - Glenn

    This is quite likely a strawman. I think the claim involved in these kind of appeals is that they've learned from (horrific) historical experience.

    Maybe you think they haven't, or haven't learned the right lessons, but this rhetorical assault on the supposed claims of superior "moral wisdom" and "some unique ability to decree what is or is not just" doesn't seem to make any contact at all with a reasonable reading of what real human beings are claiming.

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  97. Anonymous3:35 AM

    Rad Geek: You are correct that Glenn misstated things by implying the Left in Europe did not suffer under Hitler; Hitler killed very many Communists and assorted socialists. Only Stalin killed more Marxists in that era.

    However, the rest of his post more than stands, including his definition of anti-Americanism, which does not remotely constitute "obscurantism."

    Other than the correction of fact regarding Hitler killing leftists, Glenn's post stands.

    I do not, however, disagree with some of the rest of your points where several of the commenters are concerned.

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  98. As an European I must say that I wholeheartedly agree with depicting the European Left as it is in all its hypocrisy. I would only add that this picture is far too mild and gentle. I would have made much more thorough job of it.

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  99. All Things Beautiful TrackBack 'Europe Thy Name Is Cowardice' :

    "It's fascinating that this should come out of Europe. Mathias Dapfner, Chief Executive of the huge German publisher Axel Springer AG, has written a blistering attack in DIE WELT, Germany's largest daily paper, against the timid reaction of Europe in the face of the Islamic threat. This is a must read by all Americans. History will certify its correctness."

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  100. Anonymous3:00 PM

    To all who say "How dare you question________________".


    You are the problem. Whether you are on the wack-o right or the on the far left, you are the problem. Everything must be open to question. Everything is subject to criticism. Or we have lost.

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  101. Anonymous7:07 PM

    Great post, Glenn. Those (including the authors of many comments) who wish to exalt the Europeans to a position ex cathedra, merely by virtue of historical circumstance, are to say the least badly deranged. Bravo the poster who said that NO ONE is immune from criticism.
    I would posit that after sending a generation of young men up the spout 1914-1918, Europe damaged itself beyond repair. From 1939-1945, it placed itself in intensive care. As i tour the sights of Europe, I regard it as the cenotaph of a civilization that has relocated- West.

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  102. "But one thing we learned from the past is that interfering in others people's lives is not by definition the right thing to do."

    Dear God, how I wish the US had learned this before WWII. We sacrificed hundreds of thousands of our youth for these ungrateful wretches.

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  103. Charles Lindbergh told you that and what did you do to him?

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  104. Anonymous3:59 AM

    Ba'al said...
    To all who say "How dare you question________________".



    You are the problem. Whether you are on the wack-o right or the on the far left, you are the problem. Everything must be open to question. Everything is subject to criticism. Or we have lost.
    This reminds of a GENUINE human rights violation now ongoing in Austria: the detention of David Irving for alleged Holocaust Denial.

    As far As I can tell Irving never "denied the holocaust" (as if that really matters) he simply questioned the existence of homocidal gas chambers at Auschwitz(and possibly other camps). Anyone with a minimal knowledge of the period knows that most of the killings were carried out by other means. But even if he denied the Nazi genocide wholesale, why should he, and others of that persuasion, be the only collection of eccentrics and crackpots in the world to suffer persecution for their opinions in purportedly democratic countries? And we know that there are still those who minimize the crimes of Stalin, Mao et al. Ask yourself why are there no prosecutions of such people?

    Re capital punishment: the hypocrisy of the left is breathtaking when you consider that not so long ago many of them supported the murderers of the German Red Army Faction, the Italian Red Brigades and the PLO. These were not isolated terrorists, they had large support networks among the left in Europe. Just as in the case (mentioned several times before)of the executions of Nazi collaborators in Western Europe following the war this renders "the lessons of Nazism" reason for the rejection of capital punishment patently absurd. The left condones killing when the killing is of people it does not like.

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  105. Anonymous4:32 AM

    Let me amend my post:I do not include Amnesty International as part of the homocidal (i.e. mainstream) left.

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